Watch and pray for Jakarta Christian School [the censored [correction]deleted article]

July 30, 2008

A prayer and discussion point involving neighbouring Christians [based on an article which was previously censored deleted by s&p on another thread, here reproduced for those who are interested in things other than Hillsong quirks and gossip]:

Jakarta (AsiaNews) – Police evacuated the Christian Theological Arastamar Institute (STT SETIA) which is located in an eastern district of the Indonesian capital after it suffered damages during clashes between Christians and Muslims over the week-end. At least 1,500 students were moved to nearby police headquarters and a local Christian-based political party. The situation remains critical and further violence between opposite factions cannot be ruled out.

“The school foundation urged us to intervene to protect people,” said East Jakarta District Police Chief Senior Superintendent. “For this reason we moved everyone out.”

Last night hundreds of residents from the village of Kampung Pulo had taken up arms threatening to storm the school after being instigated by an imam at a local mosque who claimed that a bunch of Christian gangsters were coming to “protect” the school after it was attacked on Saturday by a Muslim mob, causing damage to the building and hurting hundreds.

In an attempt to solve the problem East Jakarta District Chief Murdani held a close door meeting with the warring parties to discuss the issue. At the same time though, he said that police would conduct a thorough investigation and check if the school’s legal status was in order and that it respected all building regulations. In case of violations he would issue orders to demolish the unlawful structures [my emphasis-ed].

At present hundreds of agents are guarding the school and have orders to stop any act of violence and disarm people.

The Arastamar High School for Theology and Biblical Studies, locally known as STT SETIA, was established by Rev Mathew Mangentang in 1987.

The SST SETIA has more than 29 branches school across the country. In Jakarta alone it has thousands of students, including 265 who were injured in latest clashes.

Tensions between Christians and Muslims flared up on Saturday following rumours that a SETIA student had stolen a motorcycle that belonged to a Muslim from a neighbouring village.

Senny Manafe, a spokesperson for the school, rejected the accusation, claiming instead that the attacks were triggered by a trivial incident. In an attempt to chase a mouse in the street, a student threw a slipper against a house owned by a local Muslim. Outraged by the deed, the latter kicked and punched the student as people gathered drawn by the rumour that a Christian student had tried to steal the Muslim’s motorbike.

“Many students suffered various injuries to the head. Others were burnt by Molotov cocktails,” Manafe said.

The violence and charges against SETIA are the work of Risman Hadi, chairman of Muslim Brotherhood Forum of Kampung Pulo Village, who in the past opposed the opening and continued existence of the Christian institute.

Reportedly, when Christian churches or schools are burned or wrecked, the occupiers naturally want to rebuild, which they can’t do without the permission of majority of the direct community, which, of course includes, largely, Muslims.

According to the article, the Christian School comes under attack from an organised mob, yet the authorities look for ways to shut it down, rather than protect the school.

Incredibly, MN suggests that the school shuts itself down, suggesting that, once they do this, the violence will stop, but, in all probability, closing down under such pressure would actually fire up militant imams in other areas, bearing in mind that this group alone has 28 other schools, involving thousands of Christian students.

No, this is called persecution, and it’s taking place in one of our neighbouring nations.

Watch and pray!

FaceLift

Credit: The Currency Lad


I Offer Devotion! I Offer Devotion!

July 29, 2008

We complain. We look at some doctrines and have considered some local ministries either a cult or cult-like. We also look at some bigger churches and the question mark is raised with them too.

    

So should we be grateful that Hillsong and other huge ministries aren’t this extreme? Or is subtlety more deceptive, therefore just as dangerous?

I encourage everyone to watch the other episodes. 10 altogether. After watching these, what are your thoughts on all this? Are we too tough on big church ministries? Or are we picking up on the early warning signs?

    
    

USA Assemblies of God (AG) Pastor Dismissed For Encouraging His Church To Leave The Movement Due To Its Departure From Biblical Standards

July 27, 2008

USA Assemblies of God (AG) Pastor Dismissed For Encouraging His Church To Leave The Movement Due To Its Departure From Biblical Standards

The AG in the USA died a self inflicted spiritual, moral, and ethical death during the Pensacola fiasco under Thomas Trask, their former Czar in Springfield, Mo.

The heir to his throne, Dr. George Wood who actually authored a booklet attacking the Toronto Experience predecessor of Pensacola compromised when the same unbiblical phenomena he himself rightly condemned transpired within the AG. We find this hypocritical. Since that time Dr. Wood, a man we believe to know better, has ignored the unbiblical agenda of Rick Warren’s   marketing psychology oriented ‘Purpose Driven Lie’. A position he persists in defending despite Warren’s interfaith pronouncements at Davos, his contra scriptural definition of evangelism,  his ecumenism, his involvement with Yoga and apostate Brian McLaren at the 2004 National Pastor’s Conference, and his forwarding with McLaren of Dan Kimbell’s book “The Emergent Church”.

We applaud Jeffrey Whittaker acting as a shepherd instead of a hireling and helping lead his flock away from the wolves as Jesus commanded by leaving the AG, a move we believe any decent pastor would make in protection of The Lord’s flock.
The fact that the AG refused to allow him to resign but dismissed him from ministry despite their written admission that he followed due protocols, underscores what many discerning Christians will see as the ethical bankruptcy and abject pseudo spirituality of a backslidden movement.

The Assemblies of God in The USA, UK, Australia, New Zealand and elsewhere is not the movement it once was but a very different movement with different doctrines that has hijacked the AG name.

From the folly of Pensacola and Thomas Trask, to the televised scandals of Hillsong and The Houstons, to the hideous hype artistry and biblical ignorance of Andrew Shearman in Britain, it is difficult for some people to view the AG leadership as anything more than a phony pack of theocratic hooligans who could give lessons in religious hypocrisy to the biblical Sanhedrin.

As a minister of the gospel of Jesus (not to be confused with the Gospel of George Wood’s friend Rick Warren) in a movement consisting of Pentecostal and Charismatic moderates who left declining movements like the AG and Elim, I extend my empathy to Jeffrey Whittacker. We would be honored to welcome him into credentialed fellowship with us at the Christian Ministerial Fellowship International (CMFI) should he wish to apply and recognition of his former AG ordination would be fairly automatic.

Meanwhile, Jeffrey L. Whittaker should wear his dismissal by the AG as a badge of honor.
It will count to his credit as a pastor on the Day of Judgment.

Below is the correspondence.

Here is rough draft of letter sent by Jeffrey L Whittaker

Dear Brethren of the General Presbytery,

It is with a very weary hand and mind that I pen this final appeal.  Having received Brother Palmer’s letter of June 11th notifying me of the Executive Presbytery’s decision, I am compelled to exhaust the last avenue afforded me by our Bylaws.  It is ironic that my question relates directly to those same Bylaws with reference to seeking a clear definition of my charges.  It has been made abundantly clear to me that my leadership role in the departure of Michiana Christian Embassy from the General Council of the Assemblies of God has met with your disapproval; that is to be expected by anyone of reasonable mind.  However, I simply desire to reiterate my basic question that has never been adequately answered by any level of leadership in our beloved movement.

WHERE, WITHIN THE BODY OF OUR DISTRICT OR GENERAL COUNCIL BYLAWS, IS IT DEFINED AS IMMORAL OR UNETHICAL FOR A LOCAL PASTOR WHO FOLLOWS BYLAW ARTICLE VI, Section 4, paragraph “d”, TO LEAD, COUNSEL, OR ADVISE A LOCAL, AUTONOMOUS ASSEMBLY IN THE ACT OF DISAFFILIATION?

I am not asking for a subjective statement of how this action makes the District and General Council Officials FEEL, but rather which AG Bylaw makes it illegal, immoral, and unethical.  Brother Palmer, you wrote in your letter:

While you followed proper protocol in how you led the church to disaffiliate, the ethical failure, in the view of the General Council Credentials Committee was that you had a part in the process.

“(I)n the view of the General Council Credentials Committee” is NOT equal in authority to “the view of the AG Constitution and Bylaws”.  By stating in Bylaw Article VI that the proper procedure for disaffiliation is that a church’s “pastor or board shall invite the district officers to participate in a specially called business meeting”, to then subsequently dismiss that same pastor as “immoral and unethical” for obeying the same Bylaws is beyond imagination.  Your present ruling is seen by all who read it as baseless and completely subjective, and perceive your reasoning as an absolute non sequitur. In addition, using Article X to support your decision for my dismissal is a classic example of circular reasoning.  Article X does not provide a legal explanation of my “alleged” moral and ethical failure, but merely labels a broad category which demands legal definition by a law explicitly describing an act as prohibited; something which the General Council Bylaws do not do in this case.

If you should choose to sponsor legislation at a future General Council to amend Articles VI or X to include explicit language forbidding credential holders from leading their local and autonomous churches in a legally defined action, very well; but as of today there is not one statement within our rules of order that supports this arbitrary, punitive, and libelous ruling!

Please answer this question using only accepted and approved AG Bylaws, or grant to me the resignation that true ethics, morals, and logic demand.  I know you do not agree with our decision, but you must recognize the fundamental right of our local church and I to make it.

Most earnestly and sincerely,

Jeffrey L. Whittaker

Their response was as follows:

June 11, 2008
Dear Jeffrey:

Greetings in the name of our living and loving Lord!
At the most recent meeting of the Executive presbytery, the following action was taken:
A Motion prevailed to deny the appeal of Jeffrey L. Whittaker that he be allowed to resign rather than be dismissed, based upon his ethical failure in leading an Assemblies of God church into a decision to pull out of the fellowship.
This decision was made after a great deal of prayerful discussion.  In making this decision it was duly noted that you and your church followed the proper procedures in terminating affiliation with the General Council of the AG (Article VI, Section 4, d).
While you followed proper protocol in how you led the church to disaffiliate, the ethical failure, in the view of the General Council Credentials Committee was that you had a part in the process.
According to Article X, Section 3, c, — “Any moral or ethical failure other than sexual misconduct” is a cause for disciplinary action.  It is the thoughtful opinion of the Executive Presbytery that you acted unethically by helping to disaffiliate a local church from the AG while you were an AG minister.

Thank you for your years of ministry with the AG.  I wish you well as you continue the ministry to which the Lord has called you.
The General Council bylaws do afford you the right of appeal to the General Presbytery (Article X, Section 10, c).

Sincerely,

John M. Palmer
General Secretary

Article is found here: http://moriel.org/articles/discernment/church_issues/USA_ag_pastor_dismissed.htm


Shine – Hillsong’s latest school outreach to young women

July 26, 2008

Hillsong Church has a program to boost young women’s self esteem, called ‘Shine’, which the Sydney Morning Herald wrote about today (Saturday 26 July 2008 ) in Hillsong’s Beauty Gospel.

The stated goal of the program is to boost self esteem in young women. Naturally, most of us will expect that it is also an outreach, a means of bringing the gospel into the lives of these young women if possible, whether that is the stated goal or not.

Teachers have criticised the program for being run by unqualified people. The article states, “Most of the facilitators who deliver Shine in Sydney classrooms have no university counselling qualifications, although Hillsong says they must have some qualifications or experience.” Some of the facilitators are graduates of Hillsong’s own leadership programs.

Psychologists are quoted in the article with concerns that the teachings objectify women, with their emphasis on appearance.

As a female Christian, I am concerned about churches promoting such programs. The New Testament teaches us not to measure people by external measures, whether they be appearance, gender or race. If a church emphasises these things, or teaches them as a means of raising self esteem, then they risk encouraging people to base their sense of self worth upon their physical appearance, which is unbiblical. While we have total freedom to get our hair done, take an interest in fashion, or do our makeup, I would hope that those things have no connection to our true sense of value in Christ.

If we we are taught to associate our self worth with these things, most of us will always fall short of some external ideal. If we base our own worth upon these things, we may also start to judge others the same way. Again, not Christ’s way.

Rather than fixing the outside, to give an appearance of self esteem, how much better to work on the inside, and practice accepting people regardless or in spite of appearance. If the outside is ‘fixed’, and the young woman still feels dreadful, does she then feel even more of a failure? Is the only thing she learns ‘how to fake it’?

Why not present a course on grooming for those who are interested, and completely separate that from self esteem? Why risk the association of the two, and its potential misdirection? Self esteem may be reflected in grooming, but for many of us it may be a matter of cleanliness and hygiene, without particular concern for added extras, except where they fit in an appropriate social context.

I am not a psychologist, but if a program is claiming to raise self esteem, I would want it to have the support of respected psychologists, rather than have it arouse their concerns. Particularly if it is likely to have women with low self esteem referred to it for help.

Its hard to comment on courses like this, in a way, as the motives sound good, if true. But the concerns raised are convincing, and are ones that Christians would normally agree with, including those raised by non-Christians who are educated in the areas taught.

Is it appropriate for churches to teach ’self esteem’ or ‘grooming’ at all? If they intend to teach self esteem through Christ, should that be made clear to all participants? Should churches use people with recognised qualifications in mental health areas, regardless of how well meaning their volunteers are?

Not all responsibility lies with Hillsong, who are not forcing the course on anyone. What kind of discernment or policies should a public school use when paying for a course to take place on their own premises for their students?

—————-

RavingPente


From Brian Getaclue Houston

July 22, 2008

A Justice Generation

Justice cannot be reduced to a project, a protest or a crusade. Justice is a HEART.

It was injustice that compelled Jesus to the cross. He stepped into humanity’s desperation; stood for what was right; healed the sick and lifted the oppressed. Wherever there was injustice Jesus responded.

We’re called to do the same. Injustice demands our response.

In this series, Brian Houston inspires us to be a generation that is:
- Indignant in the face of injustice
- Compelled by Christ’s love to make a difference
- Committed to stand up, speak out and correct what is wrong
- Motivated by compassion

Part 1: The power of justice.
Who will declare Christ’s injustice to the generations? Who will right wrongs and reach the disenfranchised? Will you?

Part 2: A heart for justice.
Justice isn’t a political issue – it’s a spiritual issue. Is your heart indignant about injustice? What part will you play?

Part 3: The heart of the King.
When your heart represents the heart of God, it’s impossible to ignore injustice. Does your heart break for the poor and the oppressed?

==========================

You too can buy Houston’s worthless trash right here:

http://www.leadershipministries.com.au/product.php?xProd=106

Make sure you waste your money on tickle-my-ears entertainment where you do nothing about injustice but marvel how wonderful Brian Houston really is! Make sure you throw up after each talk and pursue more of his great topics that is full of more crock!

In the last ten years, I don’t know one other man in his authority that has had the opportunity to speak out against injustice- yet his silence on world-wide issues is offensive and pathetic. Brian Houston talking about injustice? If he wants to see justice, he should step down that bloody hypocrite!


The Need for Greed

July 22, 2008

From http://www.news24.com/News24/South_Africa/News/0,,2-7-1442_2360893,00.html ,

News24 reports:

“God’s blessing would last only two minutes and it would create 500 churchgoing millionaires or even billionaires – all they had to do was use their credit cards to pay $1 000 in offerings to televangelist Benny Hinn.

Pastor Tommie Ferreira of the AGS Church in Johannesburg was so upset about the “blessing” that, after a week, he wanted to know who of the donors actually had become millionaires.

Ferreira told Rapport he did not mean to bring about Hinn’s downfall.

He merely wanted to know if any of the hundreds of churchgoers who donated amounts of up to $1 000 (about R7 500) to Hinn’s Miracle Crusade last week Saturday had now become millionaires.

About 18 000 people streamed to the Coca-Cola Dome in Randburg to hear Hinn’s message of healing and miracles.

Ferreira, who is a keen choir singer, voluntarily sang in the Miracle Crusade’s choir.

He said one of Hinn’s American guest speakers, Pastor Todd [C]oontz, spoke about financial burdens and said 500 audience members would receive “an exceptional blessing”.

“He said the service would yield millionaires and billionaires within 24 hours.

“Everyone had to donate $1 000 because an exceptional blessing rested on $1 000.”

[C]oontz apparently really had the congregation scrambling when he said, “This blessing will be poured out for only two minutes.”

Had credit-card machines

Ferreira said: “People stormed to the front – poor people, rich people, people from all sections of our society.”

Hinn’s co-pastors apparently had credit-card machines ready with which they could take donations.

“He ([C]oontz) said God would bless the people’s credit cards and they would be able to rule over South Africa with their money.

“Eventually there were no fewer than 1 000 people who made such donations.”

According to Ferreira’s calculations, Hinn must have collected millions of rands with these donations – perhaps more than R7m if each of the 1 000 church-goers donated $1 000 in the hope of becoming millionaires.

Furthermore, after [C]oontz’s collection of the $1 000 donations, Hinn collected general donations.

Ferreira said: “It makes my hair stand on end.”

He said he could not live with his conscience if he did not speak to others about this possible trickery.

Still collecting money

“I’m not attacking them (Hinn and [C]oontz). It just really gets my goat when people make unfounded claims and then they’re off with these people’s money.”

Dr Sarel Smit of the AGS church Lofstad in Hursthill, Johannesburg, who supported Ferreira as he spoke to Rapport, was equally worried about the method by which Hinn collected donations.

“Especially at a time like this when there is dire need, people run the risk of losing their faith in the Lord in this way. God will provide for your needs, but not your greed.”

Rapport spoke to an employee in Hinn’s South African office in Durban who said on Friday morning that they were still busy collecting money.

“We’ve had a very good reaction from last weekend,” said the employee, who asked not to be named.

He said that before the collection of the $1 000 donations, Koontz had delivered a message about “you reap what you sow”.

“Americans always talk in dollars. If some of the churchgoers believed that they would not be blessed, then they should not have given their money.

“The church-goers did not have to give $1 000. If they couldn’t afford it, then they could’ve given less. And, some of them did.

Will build an orphanage

“Pastor Todd ([C]oontz) spoke of good seeds. If you don’t actually sow them, you’ll never have a good harvest.”

The employee told Rapport that Hinn’s congregation soon would build an orphanage in South Africa.

Hinn’s South African office feeds about 1 000 children in Durban daily.

Rapport asked for a recording of [C]oontz’s sermon, but Hinn’s office said they could only provide one in four to six weeks.”


Lance and the Bloggernaut

July 22, 2008
Chase Kuhn blogs…

Many probably know Hillsong church for their popular worship albums. Most contemporary churches in the USA probably sing one or more of their songs on a Sunday. The unfortunate reality that is often not understood is their philosophy for ministry and the gospel they preach (or don’t preach).

This last Sunday night, Amy and I traveled to Hillsong with three guys from the local church plant that we have been working with here in Sydney. During the four weeks that we have been here, we have heard many jokes about Hillsong, and have read some press from the Sydney Anglicans writing against the ministry there. The main complaint is that the ministry there is nothing more than an evolved Pentecostal service that preaches a prosperity gospel. In spite of all that we had heard and read, we thought that it would be best to keep an open mind for our visit, giving them the benefit of the doubt.  The following is a summary of our visit, followed by some reflection.

Upon our arrival, the outside of the church was very large. Upon entering the inside, we walked into a busy thoroughfare, where parishoners were buying coffee, books, and presale CD’s and DVD’s. We walked past these things and entered into the arena. To our surprise, the church was smaller than we had expected. From all of the pictures we had seen of their worship rallies, we expected a massive arena, when in fact there were seats for about 3,000 (still considerably large, but not too overbearing for people from the land of mega-churches).

The service began with some amazingly produced music. There were three movie theater sized screens that were flashing images of the band and art, as well as lights moving across the stage and crowd, and there was a lot of sound. Big guitars, lots of bass, cool synths, and loud drums. The sound moved through you. The crowd was very involved in the music as most of them (15-25 yrs. old) were jumping up and down and singing. Lyrically the music was quite impressive. Most every song that we heard referred to Jesus, the gospel message, and the glory of God. These songs were often loose strands of Christianized words, however the overall message was very encouraging from a gospel perspective.

In the middle of the music, a pastor came out and gave an alter call. There was no preaching preceding this, but rather a strong movement of music. The call was in response to the songs. The pastor that gave the alter call explained that everyone had a problem of separation from God, that they could not solve that problem by themselves, and that Jesus was the answer to their problem. After this explanation he invited people to come forward if they wanted to begin to live for Jesus.

The service continued with more singing. Then another pastor came out and read from Galatians 6. He explained that we need to sow our money in order to reap rewards. He said that it is a good thing to be generous, and that the Lord blesses generosity. He prompted a video of a lady giving a testimony of how she sold things on eBay in a compulsion to give, and how her giving resulted in miracle after miracle in her life that next year. There was prayer, then more music as the offering buckets went around.

The music continued. Another, pastor came out waving prayer request cards and prayed for the Lord to answer the requests based on the promises of his Word. Then more music.

Next, Brian Houston (senior pastor) came out and gave a sermon. The theme for the evening was a heart for the household, and that evening there was a once a year special offering to support the household (the church). His sermon was on Acts 16, the story of Paul and Silas in jail, and the conversion of the jailer. The main thrust of his message was based on the word ‘hold.’ He used the words ‘hold’ and ‘household’ throughout the entirety of his message. He explained that the jailer went from putting people in the ‘hold,’ to seeing his ‘household’ converted. He said that the jailer was being ‘held’ by things. There were ‘holds’ on his life that almost kept him from what his ‘house-held.’ He applied this by saying that we all have things in our lives that may be ‘holds’ on us keeping us from what our ‘house-held’ (he used the past tense here). He gave three or four illustrations to support his point, including one about himself. He said that when he was younger, his father always favored his older brother, seeing him to have more potential. Brian said that had he allowed that ‘hold’ of his father favoring his older brother to keep him down, he may have never realized the potential of what his ‘house-held.’ In conclusion he said that whatever was ‘holding’ us (e.g. poor relationships, negativism, etc.) could be keeping us from our potential. Therefore we needed to free what our ‘house-holds.’

The evening then returned to more music. Brian’s wife came out to pray. There was a satelite feed to the other congregation in the city. There was a video about the special offering and their hopes for work around the city and around the world. The bucket was passed for the offering. Then more music. Finally, there was an encore, as people shouted “one more song.”

So what do we make of this first-hand encounter of Hillsong’s ministry. In our discussion following the service, we decided to start with positives first, before we offered critiques. Therefore, that is where I shall begin.

Positively:
*The music was about as good as a production could be. It would rival any good rock show. This includes quality of sound and theatrics.
*Lyrically, the music included the gospel message. The aim of the lyrics was glory to God. *There was a very clear missional element to their lyrics that encouraged the hearer to be active in the world for the kingdom.
*The video for the giving was very good, as it portrayed a vision for aid around the world and Sydney. This sounded like gospel work (though this did not match Brian’s words).
*They (the Church leaders) seemed to know their audience. The music and style of the service fit well with the demographic of the service. The service we attended was definitely a youth service. The only old couple in the congregation (maybe mid 60’s) was sitting behind us. At one time I turned around to see how he was responding to the service. When I looked he had his cheeks puffed out, exhaling, and he was rubbing his ears as if to express “wow! that was intense (and LOUD!!!!)!” ( I chuckled when I saw him! ) )
*There was an expressed care for people.
*There was a gospel presentation. It was not clear in explaining sin, or the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, or even faith. However, there was clearly an attempt to connect people with Christ. The preacher clearly said that we all are separated from God, and Jesus is the only answer.

Negatively:
*The sermon was rubbish (as the Aussies would say). To translate: The sermon was garbage!!! I am quite certain that it was the worst sermon that I have heard. The content was terrible. Brian clearly had an agenda, the word ‘hold’ and ‘household,’ and he used the Word to accomodate his message. His sermon had no relation to the text at all. In his message he never even addressed the fact that the change agent for the jailer was JESUS!!! His message was a prosperity/ self-help talk. Besides the content, his delivery was also terrible. He was very slow on his feet, and unorganized in his thoughts. And in all seriousness (and not to poke fun) he has a preacher’s voice that sounds like a pirate (I comment on this because I think it was manufactured.  If this is his natural voice and not a part of his image I apologize).
*The push for giving was given in the attitude that if you give you will be blessed with miracles.

*The gospel was presented in a loose way, but it was not presented in fulness.  It was not clearly stated why we are separated from God (sin), or why Jesus is the answer to our separation from God (namely because of the atonement he made for us by his death, burial and resurrection).  It also was not explained clearly what the gospel means for our lives.  The preacher did call people to live for Jesus, but I would hope that there would be further explanation of what it means to walk in the newness of life.

Synopsis:
I want to err on the side of charity. I think that there are many people at Hillsong who truly love Jesus. I think that there are some there who would be gospel believing Christians. That being said, I also think that the church is doing a very poor job at feeding their sheep. Their diet is an emotional one of musical experience. The Word is absent. It is not absent as though it is not read, but it is absent in that it is not taught. People are in fact being lead astray by a false gospel. They do teach that Jesus is the only way to God, but they also believe that the Christian life equals a life of prosperity in this world.  In fact, there message seems to make a heavy appeal to this end.The music is very good, but it is a concert. A personal hobby-horse of mine is flashy production in a worship service. Though I am typically against this, their production is done in such a way that there is a large amount of audience participation. The draw for the church is clearly the music.

I think for churches around the world, it is okay to use their music, but there must be an understanding of the church which is generating the music. Most of the Sydney Anglicans do not use Hillsong music because they are in the same town and they do not want to associate Hillsong and its teaching of a prosperity gospel. It is their way of boycotting the message. Concerning Brian, he seemed very out of place in the service. The service would have been close (note the word close!) to permissible without him. His message was an atrocity, and it made my stomach hurt (not exageratting). It is sad to reflect from a ministerial position on the many lives he is misleading. He will surely have to answer to God. (This may seem harsh, but this is not something to take lightly).

Hillsong is a church with a lot of missed potential. Each weekend they draw a crowd of well over 10,000 people. During that time they would have a great opportunity to share the gospel and the Word with their congregants. Unfortunately, people are being mislead by poor teaching and emotional hype. I fear that many who attend will fizzle out when their emotions become stale. Their faith is currently based on experience, but when their experience changes, I wonder where their faith will reside.

After talking to my Anglican friends here, I empathize and side with them. If we allow for poor teaching one generation, what will happen in the next generation? False teaching should not be permitted. I think my overall approach would be similar to Paul’s response to the Corithians. He was keen to recognize them as brothers and sisters in Christ, but was sure to rebuke them for their mislead life. I think that Hillsong does have some genuine believers, however they are mislead and their life and faith reflect that. My prayer is that there will be a change of heart amongst the leadership and the congregation, that they might have a clear passion for the Word of God. Then there worship will not only be in Spirit, but also in Truth.”

And FWIW, I (Lance) added the following comment to the post.

“I’ve researched Hill$ong for a few years, and I’d point out that what you heard was not a failure to explain the gospel, but their own spin on or version of the gospel.Hill$ong does not see the gospel as justification through faith in Christ’s blood via repentence from sin.

Hill$ong sees Christ’s death and resurrection as an expression of God’s power, and therefore if you believe in Jesus you share in an ‘empowerment to live an awesome life.’

It takes the consequences of embracing the gospel, and makes it the ‘gospel’ itself.

The key to understanding Hill$ong’s ‘gospel’ is their alternative definition of grace.

Whereas a regular evangelical would see grace as God’s unmerited favour on an undeserving sinner (amazing grace that saved a wretch like me), Hill$ong teaches that God gives you ‘grace’ ..that is power (as long as you do all the right things like tithe..etc)….to fulfil ‘God’s amazing plan for your life’.

That is… they believe God ‘graces’ you to live your life in power and authority.

Hill$ong bypasses the whole sin thing altogether. The closest they get to acknowledging sin is that they sometimes admit that believers ‘make mistakes’…(as opposed to sinning), but teaches that believers should not live in regret or ‘negativity’.

So when someone like you goes to Hill$ong, although you’ll hear a lot of the same words like ‘Jesus’ and ‘born again’ or ‘following Christ’…the assumptions you have about those terms and the assumptions they have about what those terms mean are very different.

It took me years to figure out the difference between what Hill$ong believes and classical Christianity…and that was only after studying transcripts of their teachings and writings.

So I wouldn’t expect someone who’s been there on a first visit..or even a few weeks or months…to get a handle on what’s not right about the place.

BTW. On Hill$ong’s website you can read their statement of beliefs…which cover the traditional ground of sin, repentence, the blood (it’s a copy and paste of standard AOG beliefs)….blah, blah, blah…but that’s not what Hill$ong teaches from week to week.”


Article from the SectsFiles

July 22, 2008

Great article posted up by Lance from his site http://groupsects.wordpress.com/! Here’s my Christian view: BRING IT ON!

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The Australian reports….

“Between now and August 29 the Senate Standing Committee on Economics will receive a flood of submissions into one of the most controversial and political hot potatoes: an inquiry into the disclosure regime for charities and not-for-profit organisations in Australia.

After that, the Senate has almost three months to finalise a report that has the potential to rock Australia’s $80 billion-plus non-profit sector.

The inquiry will examine the appropriateness of disclosure levels in the sector, models of regulation and legal forms that would improve governance and management of charities and not-for-profit organisations and other measures to improve governance, standards, accountability and transparency in its use of public and government funds.

Depending how gutsy the report wants to be, it could recommend a complete overhaul, starting with the creation of a charities commission, similar to the model adopted in Canada, Britain, and New Zealand, which would streamline all charities under the one regulator.

It could also enforce a set of accounting standards to ensure that all not-for-profit organisations quantify and detail the size of tax exemptions, grants and donations, as well as recognising three core business segments: raising funds, administering funds and spending funds.

This would enable charities to be monitored for best practice. It could also take the opportunity to recommend an overhaul of the Banking Act so that if a religious group sets up an investment scheme, it is subject to the same regulatory rigours as any other investment scheme.

At the moment, religious groups with financial activities are exempt from the Banking Act. And if it had the stomach to take on the religious groups, it could recommend a working towards competitive neutrality to bring Australia into line with most other countries by forcing religious groups to pay tax on earned-income ventures such as pizza and coffee chains, cereal businesses, and wineries that have little or nothing to do with charitable work. Every few years new governments launch an inquiry into the not-for-profit sector, which ranges from charities, religious groups, clubs and health funds, in an attempt to fix a sector that represents almost 10 per cent of the economy, employs more than 600,000 people and represents more than 700,000 organisations. This time it was prompted by the Australian Democrats, Andrew Murray and Lyn Allison, who in March called for an inquiry by the Senate. It was their parting gift to a sector that is in a mess. Both retired from politics on June 30.

The Democrats have set the ball in motion, so now it is up to the Rudd Government to do something about a sector in dire need of reform. It is one of the most powerful, far-reaching sectors in the country, yet it lacks governance standards, accountability and transparency in its use of public and government funds. Indeed, as governments increasingly outsource more and more areas of business to the non-profit sectors, by making them government service providers in areas like the Job Network, and sign contracts with them worth billions of dollars, the need for transparency and accountability is critical. In an era of corporate regulation, most parts of the non-profit sector are unregulated.

There is no process for the registration of charities, no consistent collection of information about the activities or funding sources of charities and there is little or no monitoring of the activities of charities. The upshot is there is no means by which the public can ensure that a charitable organisation is pursuing the activities and purposes it claims to carry out. It also means that the Australian Government has no idea how big the sector is, or how much it forgoes in tax a year. The access to charitable status is currently regulated by the Australian Taxation Office (ATO). But the ATO has limited expertise in the regulation of charities. In a submission to a government review of the sector in September 2000, the ATO itself recommended the establishment of a separate body to regulate access to charitable status at the federal government level. “It’s our view that the current system of tax concessions provides an unnecessary layer of administrative cost and complexity, and lacks transparency. We would accordingly favour a single targeted, transparent and accountable program of direct outlays.” Most charities do a terrific job. Some release detailed accounts to the public of how much they earn, and how they spend the money. But there is no law that says they have to _ and many do not.

There is also little accountability of where the money goes or the businesses that these organisations operate. It is no surprise, then, that some not-for-profit groups run businesses. For instance, the Seventh Day Adventists run food business Sanitarium Health Foods, which is believed to turn over more than $300 million a year. The Catholic Church, which turns over more than $15 billion a year, runs schools, hospitals, insurance companies, car parking lots and a funds management business. The biggest Pentecostal church, Hillsong, sells CDs, DVDs, self-help books and T-shirts. Australia is one of the few places in the world where these types of business are not taxed. Most other countries treat companies run by the non-profit sector like any other corporation: forced to pay tax if they make a profit. In the interests of budget honesty and transparency, taxpayers are entitled to know who is entitled to tax concessions under both commonwealth and state legislation……..”

From http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24048769-5012439,00.html


Repression or Reconciliation?

July 19, 2008

Facelift said, “…I came in at the end, and copped flack for suggesting forgiveness as an option.”

(From Another Abusive Cult Exposed.)

Wazza said, “So the “forgive or you won’t be forgiven” rule is excellent when we use it as a measure and a warning to ourselves. If we use it to say “I know you are hurt by what I did, but you must forgive me or else the Father will not forgive you”, then it is abusive and I believe not what it was meant to be used for.”

(From How well does the church like Jesus gospel?)

Following the example of Jesus, are Christians also to freely forgive, regardless of the offense, and in cases where the offender is not sorry and does not believe they have sinned?

Forgiveness seems to be helpful for the victim of abuse to ultimately heal and move on. Forgiveness can take place even if the person forgiven does not agree or know they have done anything that needs forgiving, and whether or not the percieved offense was really an offense or not. Forgiveness does not have to require a dialogue between the victim and the offender.

Forgiveness is not denial that a wrong occurred, and does not have to require a renewal of trust between people.

Reconciliation of the relationship between God and man was one of the purposes of Jesus ministry. How does this come into cases of spiritual abuse?

Reconciliation is not the same thing as forgiveness. It requires both parties to enter dialogue, and sometimes a third party is needed to facilitate the conversation. If one party sees no need for reconciliation and will not engage with the other party, its hard to see how true reconciliation can take place.

Reconciliation would likely require parties to take responsibility for their contribution to the perceived problem. The abuser would need to listen to the victim. In the case of spiritual abuse, if the abuser will not take responsibility for any harm or admit any wrongs, reconciliation is highly unlikely to be achieved. Without genuine reconciliation, including admissions of responsibility and a commitment to correcting the actions that caused the wrong in the first place, it is not safe for the victim of abuse to return, even if forgiveness has been achieved. Even under those conditions it may not be safe, as cultural change does not occur overnight.

Does a Christian need to reconcile with their abuser, or just forgive? How far should a Christian go when seeking reconciliation where they perceive they have been mistreated by someone more powerful? Sometimes, Christians are taught true forgiveness means to ‘forget’ the offense. Where an act of abuse has repeatedly occurred, can it be repeatedly forgotten?

Sometimes it seems that Christians who have been hurt are expected to behave as though reconciliation has taken place, and as if no pain had occurred, to show that they have exercised ‘forgiveness’. This can be an act of repression, not true reconciliation.

Do church authorities commonly recognise that there is a difference between reconciliation and forgiveness?

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RavingPente


Jukebox is back – special Jesus-free version of “Shout to the Lord”

July 17, 2008

As seen on American Idol – Starting with the moving line “My Shepherd, My Saviour”

Coming soon – new versions of old hymns and choruses :

“Come thou long expected Shepherd”

“His name is Shepherd”

“Shepherd what a beautiful name”