Pastoring and Parenting Free of Guilt and Fear

There are lots of potential problems inherent in churches with the necessity for large organisational structures and large amounts of infrastructure. One potential problem is that people can become viewed more as resources than people, as Bull mentioned here recently on another thread.

If people are viewed as resources, one of the temptations then becomes to attempt to control them like resources. Various forms of control might include teaching that induces guilt or fear if they don’t do the ‘right’ thing, or exclusion from various ‘levels’ of involvement if certain required behaviours are not committed to. The latter is not necessarily immoral, but may be questionable at times due to its context in a ‘church’ setting, where theoretically people are all equals as part of the body of Christ, rather than members of a club with different strata.

The Purpose Driven approach from Rick Warren has aspects of the above, in my view, and John Bevere’s influential and popular teaching has other aspects of the above in my view. Many churches love both of these authors.

I’ve become used to thinking of megachurch environments as places where to some degree these things will happen, while also admitting that its possible in any organised setting regardless of size. My view is that over time, the degree to which they happen negatively affects the quality of relationships in the church, especially between leaders and those they lead. When fear and guilt are used as motivators, this can reduce the relationship between those in positions of authority and those not, to relationships with different degrees of power, rather than relationships of mutual love, respect and honour. It will also affect to some degree the way many members of the congregation view God – as a loving, generous, safe and forgiving Father (as in the parable of the Prodigal Son), or as an authoritarian Father whom they must please in order to be blessed.

But is my thinking really true? Could there be megachurches that encourage people throughout the body without seeking to control them through these methods? Will their ministries emulate this, both in their service to others, and towards those within their own ministry team? Once I would have thought that the latter happened almost as a matter of course; in more recent times, I came to the view that the former happens to some degree at least, as a matter of course. But its good to question your own beliefs, including this one.

So this long preamble is really leading up to a discovery that I’m so far delighted by – I’m reading a Christian book about parenting that really seems to understand the difference between controlling from the outside (typically using fear of some kind) and motivating from the inside; the heart. I’ve only read the first couple of chapters, but the understanding of the way God loves us; the way He is a Father to us and gives us freedom, which we then learn to responsibly manage, and that we can learn to emulate this in our parenting, is so encouraging.

The book, ‘Loving Our Kids On Purpose’, by Danny Silk, exposes as a lie the idea that we can control others, even our children, and sees the goal of obedience and compliance as an inferior one to the goal of love and relationship, where kids learn to make good choices and handle their freedom with responsiblity.

The thing that has struck me, is that the author of this book, Danny Silk, is the Family Life Pastor at a megachurch, Bethel Church in Redding, California (senior Pastor Bill Johnson). If they approach leading their church in a similar way to that described for building relationships in this book, then even if they have mistaken theology in some areas (and we all probably do), then I imagine that the church will stay fairly healthy. People will have the freedom to develop the way God leads them, rather than in some set way that is designated for them by an outside authority with a ‘resource’ driven approach. Leaders across the board in this kind of congregation, are likely to respect people’s freedom, and encourage rather than seek to control.

I hope this is the case. At the very least it is encouraging to see the other end of the spectrum of contemporary Christian views in this area. And the book, ‘Loving Our Kids On Purpose’, by Danny Silk is excellent so far. I am looking forward to incorporating the tools into my own parenting.

This link/post is not meant as an ad, but as a touchstone for thoughts on the issues – but some of you might be interested in checking the book out here.

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RavingPente

Seeker Sensitive Bait and Switch

This is a question that occurred to me after reading Rick Warren’s email to Saddleback, where he said:

We also do not expect unbelievers to act like believers until they have the power of Christ inside them. Laws and politics cannot transform hearts, which is why we refuse to be political activists.

– Warren

I agree with his sentiments here. The question it raises for me, is when does the expectation for new Christian’s to ‘act like believers’ begin, and what does it look like? Sometimes God’s transforming work in people is visible immediately, but other times people may struggle with an issue for a long time, yet still believe.

What do churches define ‘acting like a believer’ to entail? Obviously something is expected of believers by Warren’s church, and many others. Is it a matter of demonstrating improving character traits over time, or is it a matter of conforming to the churches cultural expectations – such as tithing or attendance expectations? Some churches don’t seem to differentiate between the two.

Frequently churches do offer great acceptance to non-Christians who are struggling with issues. Once they become a Christian, does the attitude of acceptance change, and pressure begin? Can this be a kind of ‘bait and switch’ – offering unconditional love and acceptance but switching it for the conditional variety later? Is that how Jesus wanted us to do things?

Maybe that’s why we see some people reacting so angrily after being rejected by a church for sinful behaviour. If they experienced that wonderful acceptance and love to begin with, and responded in kind, then they experience rejection from people they grew to love, and will be upset or angry. It’s a bit like offering a kid a lolly, then snatching it from them and being outraged when they cry.

Those who emphasise repentance do at least let people know that there is a price to pay; perhaps that approach is more honest. But the seeker sensitive variety of church can still emphasise turning to Jesus, which in itself is a turning from darkness and sin towards light. Plus emphasising repentance does place pressure on people who may find themselves unable to live up to their repentance in some more obvious ways, and give up.

Knowing Jesus in my view entails walking with him through problems and issues, including these difficult ones, which aren’t necessarily resolved overnight. As we know more Light, we turn from more darkness, and mature over time. But on the way, we might not always look as though we are ‘acting like believers’.

Are we sometimes too impatient with God’s work in people when it doesn’t always take place overnight? Where should a line be drawn? Do some churches using a ‘bait and switch’ tactic, and is it OK?

Revival at Saddleback

Speaking of ‘Purpose Driven’ (in my last comment on the previous thread), apparently there is a revival taking place at Rick Warren’s church in Saddleback.  Warren feels that the recessionary times are causing more people to turn to God, and Saddleback is helping many of these people out with a large increase in food parcels etc.

I received this email from Facelift (please no comments regarding him since he can’t reply), and am putting it up here for any comments, since we’ve discussed Rick Warren and his Purpose Driven philosphy before, though not for a while.  Rick Warren notably has rejected the big salary and trappings that a man of his fame could have in Christian circles.

I am quite uncomfortable with the Purpose Driven approach, myself, however, its worth taking a look at what is going on at Saddleback right now.  It is extremely well organised, and does show what good organisation on a large scale can achieve.  It is a very influential movement which will and is affecting churches around the world.

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RavingPente

Could the revival happening at Saddleback spread nationally?

“The Lord has done great things for us, and we are filled with joy.“
Psalm 126:3 (NIV)

Dear Saddleback Family,

In January, during my “Recession or Revival?” weekend series, I pointed out that history often demonstrates the fact that difficult times are fertile ground for spiritual awakenings.

Whether in biblical days or in the past 400 years, when people feel like giving up, some look up to God. I announced that we needed to prepare ourselves for the possibility that God would send revival in our midst during this recession. We now see it happening at Saddleback! In the past 60 days, our church family has experienced the greatest period of revival in our 30 year history.

Revival is an often misused and misunderstood word. Many so-called “revivals” are just emotional spectacles fueled by promotion with little biblical basis or result. So let me explain and illustrate some (not all) of the marks of true revival:

TRUE REVIVAL BRINGS SALVATION & TRANSFORMED LIVES!
In April, we averaged over 40 people EVERY DAYcoming to Christ for salvation! Like the first church in Jerusalem, “the Lord added DAILY those who were being saved.” Over 1,200 new adult believers were baptized in April alone! Saddleback members witness to their unsaved friends like no other congregation in America.

Recently I baptized over 800 adults on a single afternoon, spending nearly five hours in our baptism pool! I wish you could have heard the testimony of each transformed life.

TRUE REVIVAL BRINGS REPENTANCE & HOLY LIVING
The stories of confession, reconciliation, and commitment to the biblical disciplines of prayer, daily Bible reading, and humble acts of service have thrilled our hearts. Who will ever forget watching thousands of people nailing their lists of sins to a cross at our weekend service?

TRUE REVIVAL BRINGS SPECTACULAR GROWTH OF THE CHURCH!
Recently, over 2,600 people joined our church on aSINGLE DAY, committing to our membership covenant, and attending our four-hour Membership Class 101. We’ve offered Class 101 every month for 30 years and usually about 100 to 200 people attend and commit to our membership requirements. Imagine a membership class with 2,600 joining on one day!
50,334 people worshiped at one of our 46 Easter services. 45% of these people (not including the children in AllStars) were under 39 years of age. Pundits erroneously speculated why I cancelled two TV interviews with George Stephanopoulos and Mike Huckabee on Easter weekend, but I was simply overwhelmed with our 46 services and needed to conserve energy!

TRUE REVIVAL LEADS TO MINISTRY IN THE COMMUNITY
During these days of revival, 20,000 grocery bags were given out and you returned over 40 TONS OF GROCERIES to feed the poor, the widows, and orphans around us. During this recession, you’ve once again been a beacon of hope to our community. I wish you could read the thank-you letters from people who have never previously attended a church.

Over 30,000 of you are now ministering to your neighbors through our 4,000 plus small groups across 146 cities of Southern California. Our weekend series on “The Jesus Model” and our small group curriculum series, Wide Angle: A Christian Worldview, that Chuck Colson and I taped for you are reaping more changed lives in our communities.

TRUE REVIVAL LEADS TO GREATER MISSION AROUND THE GLOBE
No church in history has ever sent more members on mission around the world. On our recent 5th anniversary of the PEACE Plan we celebrated the 8,292 Saddleback members who’ve served overseas in the past five years. Saddleback mission teams have now served in 134 nations!

Then last weekend, 2,908 more families signed PEACE Commitment cards to GO and GIVE in the next 18 months. This will enable us to complete our 10 by 10 goals, including being the first local church in Christian history to literally obey Christ’s command to “go to EVERY NATION” by the end of next year!

Why does God continue to bless Saddleback in unprecedented ways, and what would it take for this local revival to spread nationally?
Many factors contribute to God’s continued blessing of Saddleback. Some are unexplainable, like God’s sovereign grace, and others are the result of choices God’s Spirit has led us to make. Obedience brings blessing. I could list a dozen factors but I’ll only mention a couple:

WE REFUSE TO BE DISTRACTED FROM JESUS’ PURPOSES FOR HIS CHURCH
For 30 years, we have kept a laser focus on the five biblical purposes of worship, fellowship, discipleship, ministry, and evangelism. We refuse to be distracted by secondary issues, legalistic bickering, misinformed accusations, or envious critics. “Avoid foolish arguments, stupid controversies, spiritual quarreling, quibbles, and conflicts. These are pointless and worthless” (Titus 3:9). “Anyone who lets himself be distracted from the work I plan for him is not fit for the Kingdom of God” (Luke 9:62). While others debate the church, we just DO it!

We have a BIBLICAL plan & PROCESS TO CARE FOR AND DEVELOP DISCIPLES TO full MATURITY, AND TO MOBILIZE THEM FOR MINISTRY & MISSION.
When God wants to bring a bumper crop of new baby believers into the world, he looks for the warmest incubator he can find. Most churches are unprepared to care for large numbers of new believers. Saddleback has a proven discipleship process that has brought tens of thousands to maturity. Most churches believe in discipleship but their only plan is to preach it. Since people forget 90-95% of what they hear within 72 hours, it takes far more than listening to exposition to develop a mature disciple. A national study by Lifeway revealed that churches using the Jesus Model discipleship process we learned from Jesus (from “come and see” to “come and die”) are healthier, produce far more mature members, lead in generosity, and send more out on mission than just teaching churches.

WE DEEPLY LOVE LOST PEOPLE THE WAY JESUS DOES.
We are not afraid to associate with unbelievers or people we disagree with. You cannot win your enemies to Christ; you can only win your friends. So we purposefully build bridges of love to people so Jesus can walk across that bridge and save them. We don’t view unbelievers as “the enemy” in a “culture war” rather we see them as the mission field and as people Jesus shed his blood for. We do not compromise our biblical convictions, but we do apologize if we act or saying anything in unloving ways.

We also do not expect unbelievers to act like believers until they have the power of Christ inside them. Laws and politics cannot transform hearts, which is why we refuse to be political activists. Jesus said “I did not come to condemn the world, but to save it.” We want to have a Christlike ministry, which means we will be called “the friend of sinners” and will be attacked by modern day Pharisees and those who view everything in political terms. But the results are worth it: Over 22,000 new believers have been baptized in the past 10 years and we will spend eternity rejoicing with them!

Today I read again these words from my friend and mentor, John Stott: “The mistake the Pharisees made was worse than being a mistake about the meaning of holiness. It was actually a mistake about the very nature of God. They thought he avoided sinners, whereas God doesn’t avoid sinners at all. God loves sinners. He comes after them! He went after them to the desolate agony of the Cross. He has come after them in the Holy Spirit, and he is pursuing them himself today!”

WE TAKE RISKS IN FAITH
While others splash around safely in the shallows of their comfortable church culture, you Saddleback members have always been willing to launch out into the deep where the big fish are. Our 30-year history has been one of attempting in faith what others fear to do. But where God guides, he provides. This year, we launched a risky new distribution channel to provide Bible study curriculum to church small groups nationwide. This “curriculum by subscription” (the 21st century version of the Sunday school quarterly) is The Purpose Driven Connection magazine. In a year when every other magazine is cutting back staff, we launched one – in a never-done-before format. The result? Churches worldwide are receiving solid small group materials and our second issue WON A PULITZER PRIZE for an article!

Friends, genuine revival is our only hope. Nothing else can heal our hearts, our families, our land, our world. That’s why we’re making an enormous effort to serve other churches this fall through aNational Life’s Healing Choices Campaign beginning in September. The eight principles of the Beatitudes of Jesus are the true path to recovery – whether personal or national recovery. Pray that other churches will join us in humbly following the path our Master has laid out in the Beatitudes. And pray that our efforts to serve other churches and small groups with this quarterly curriculum will result in transformed lives for the global glory of God!

It is a privilege to be your pastor. I love you with all my heart.

Rick Warren
Saddleback Church
Purpose Driven Network
P.E.A.C.E. Coalition

Gifts – or Convenient Labels?

Ephesians 4:8-12 (NOT!)

⁸…AND HE GAVE CONVENIENT LABELS TO MEN…[big snip]… ¹²for the categorising of the saints for the work of service, to the smooth running of the religious organisations of men.”

- Heretic’s Private Translation (RP’s Toned Down Version*)

Has anyone ever filled out one of those ‘gift questionaires’, which churches sometimes use to help people identify their giftings?  They are a little like a less sophisticated version of personality testing.  I haven’t seen one for many years, but I remember filling them in maybe 20 years ago.

No one would dispute that we are all gifted in different ways, and that scripturally all these gifts are valuable and have their place in the body of Christ.  Sometimes though, ‘gifts’ can pigeonhole people, who then may end up stuck in a role until they are totally sick of it.  (Different from the concept of burn out.)  Sometimes perhaps they don’t get the chance to explore an area they really are more gifted in.

Some may be gifted musically.  This is great – until the worship team becomes small, and they are called on almost every week, with no break or subjected to an overly onerous schedule.  Others may be gifted at looking after children – the same thing can happen.  They may find themselves almost never making it to an actual church service.

A friend of mine is very talented with hospitality.  After a while, people would say to them, why don’t you organise this social event, or why don’t we do this at your place, as you have the gift of hospitality.  I think my friend does have this gift – but as a result, they weren’t often on the receiving end of others’ hospitality.

Of course we can all participate in other ways as you don’t need a particular gift to serve in some areas – doing my turn in the creche for example, despite having no special ability there (and a distinct absence of ability at some times).

Everyone has joked at times about the gift of stacking chairs or cleaning toilets!

Anyway, this is not a complaint – more a question of how widespread is this pigeonholing, and has anyone seen it dealt with effectively?  Its hard for some people to get the chance to try out some other area – it may already be full of people gifted in it, or they may be so busy with what they always do that its just not convenient to move people around – or people don’t want to move around.

As for me, I did many things over my time in churches, but the only gift I was regularly told I had, was the gift of encouragement.  So I was lucky, I guess, since my ‘gift’ was unable to be scheduled, and not burdensome!     Though I used to wonder – is that just what they tell you when you don’t have any other specific talent? In my early days, I was a little disappointed to have such an unspectacular gift!

*The original version may or may not have included the term, ‘Whore of Babylon’.

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RavingPente

Teaching Superstition; Giving on Stage

Teaching Superstition

I watched a TV show by Derren Brown the other night, which looked at how people develop superstition.  In a nutshell, people identify actions with effects that have nothing to do with each other, but associate a causal link between the the two without any real examination.

An example might be walking under a ladder, then later blaming that for a subsequent fortunate accident.  Derren Brown repeated a social experiment where a buzzer operated every time a goldfish swam past a black line on a fish tank.  The people in an adjacent room thought their actions were causing the buzzer to operate, and associated random behaviours with the buzzer, which were then repeated to try to earn more buzzes.  One hundred buzzes in half an hour would earn a prize, so they were motivated.

At Pentecostal churches I’ve attended, I’ve seen various people lauded on the platform for giving large sums of money to building funds or various church causes, with an associated testimony of how God blessed them in response to this.  An example would be the one we covered on this blog last year where Phil Pringle invited up a couple who gave to the miracle offering at the Presence Conference and subsequently fell pregnant.  The successful pregnancy and birth was attributed to them giving to the miracle offering.  This was used as an incentive to inspire (or manipulate) more people to give to that year’s offering.

But where is the causal link between these people’s giving to these purposes and God answering their prayers?  Maybe in His grace He would have answered their prayers anyway; maybe He answered their prayers despite what they did.

What about Acts 8:9-23? Simon the magician is rebuked for thinking he can buy God’s gifts with money.  In his case, the gift he wanted was the ability to perform miracles; to infuse people with the Holy Spirit.   Peter responded to him, saying “^20…“May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money!”

It’s ironic that this response of Peter’s is the opposite of the financial salvation some people hope for when they give to these offerings.

Giving is good when done freely, but we are not to try to ‘buy’ gifts from God.  Yet people who teach this, teach superstition – that if you give to this particular offering, you have the _chance_ of having your prayer answered – and conversely, if you don’t, you could miss out.  It pretty much lines those people up with soothsayers and magicians, whom the Bible tells us we should have nothing to do with.

Putting these people up on stage and claiming their answered prayer is because they gave to an offering is a way of reinforcing this message and is pretty much what Derren Brown demonstrated.

Giving On Stage

Putting individuals up on stage at all to describe the magnitude of their giving is pretty woeful in any case.  I have seen it though, numerous times during building campaigns.  Once again, the aim is to encourage people to give substantial sums of a greatly sacrificial nature.  (As much or more than a deposit for a home, in most cases on stage.)

Generally the people would testify of how much they pledged, and the subsequent miracle events that had happened that allowed them to meet this pledge, that was well beyond their means.  Somehow, despite the miracles, I was never quite comfortable with this way of announcing it.  Perhaps it was my conservative Anglican background, but this scripture seemed relevant:

Matt 6:2-4

²“So when you give to the poor, do not sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, so that they ^(B)may be honored by men ^(C)Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full.

³“But when you give to the poor, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,

⁴so that your giving will be in secret; and ^(D)your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you.

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RavingPente

Consulting The Dead

How then should we pray?

For quite a while now, I’ve heard from numerous Christian’s, (when in argument about people like Rick Joyner, Benny Hinn, Crowder, Todd Bentley, Bob Jones and many others pray to the dead), that it’s alright to do so.

I’ve always used the scripture that “God is God of the Living” only to have others claim that Christian’s are in heaven and are therefore ‘living’.  More specifically, in Rick Joyner’s book “The Final Quest”, he talks to the Apostle Paul, a revivalist and his wife, a dead member of his congregation and some others. He talks to other dead figures in some of his other books and the controversial figure “Enoch”.

As a result, there have been some claims that various Old Testament prophets have spoken to people. I would like to test their claims, but have not looked into them.

Is it biblical now to pray to the “dead” Christians. Or are we returning to Roman Catholic teachings and practices? In praying to Christians, does this compromise anything in our Christian walk and if not, what is the benefit of this?

Those that say the dead are “alive” in heaven, do they have a good biblical or gospel understanding of “glorification”, “resurrection”, eschatology, anthropology or Christology? What scriptures can we use to support/object praying to the “living dead”?

The Sadness of Moving On

I know of a number of people at the moment dealing with the grief resulting from realising that certain beliefs and teachings they based a large part of their lives and actions on may well have been empty.  For me the first doctrine to tumble was tithing, for others it might be that their church would look after them; for others it might be the revelation that the pastor(s) they looked up to are human and do not have any greater degree of access to revelation than most anyone else does – this is seen when their teaching or advice is proven foolish in some way.  Or there may even be some tangible wrong done that reveals a disillusioning truth.

It seems that frequently the closer to the church hierarchy a person has been, the greater the likelihood of damage.  There may be a lot of anger to deal with as part of the grief process.  For some people this may be exacerbated by a sense of betrayal or actual betrayal by others they worked with inside the system, or by the organisation itself in terms of a general lack of support when they need it, after years of sacrifice.

My own sense of grief was partly a sense of how terrible it was that people who want to follow Jesus are being taught certain packs of lies in His name, things which bind them up (unknowingly), when He came to set us free. It was grieving to think on the suffering caused by this, and the damage in the lives of certain people.

The reality that scripture teaches does set us free from all these things, but only God can really reveal this to people – it is so contrary to a man-made view of things.  Much of this false doctrine seems to be partly a result of churches absorbing a pragmatic approach to scripture, which distorts what it says.  It is hard to understand something that turns the human approach to things upside down.

How then do we help those we come across who are in the midst of this grief process?  We know that they will not find understanding amongst those who don’t see what they see. It is important that we do all eventually find our way through and out the other side of this process, side by side with Jesus, but it can take a long time.  For some it may be a real test of their faith; they lose friends and their church family; they may feel that years of their lives were possibly wasted (though I believe in God this is not necessarily so).  They may find themselves walking in a wilderness and feeling very alone.  Some may experience condemnation from former friends, or even attacks on their reputation.  It is even harder if they have been on staff.

I suppose that I hope places like this one can exist partly so these people can know they are not alone, and acceptance of their pain and experiences will hopefully help in a healing process.

At the end of the day, its about our relationship with Jesus deepening, and encouraging one another in that, in whatever form it takes, I think.  He is with us in our sadness, though it may for some feel like He is not there at all.  For some of us it is necessary to walk this sad walk, in order to come out the other side and emerge in a much better place for us.

God bless all who are going through this, and I pray that they will find joy and peace again, in it, through it, and once out the other side.

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RavingPente