Can a child really have two mums?

ACL points out that the NSW government wants to pervert the family ideal by asserting that a child can have two mothers named on their birth certificate, thus eliminating the name of the actual father, even in cases where IVF has been utilised.

Despite the best efforts of pro-family organisations, NSW politicians this week passed law changes that undermine families and dismiss dads from some kids’ birth certificates.

The biologically correct, legal presumption that all children have one father and one mother has been replaced by the recognition that a child has two parents. Instead of listing their father and mother, some children’s birth certificates will now list their two mothers.

The Miscellaneous Acts Amendment (Same Sex Relationships) Bill 2008 was passed on Wednesday. ACL’s media release from Monday 2nd June (before the bill was passed) provides more detail on its provisions. Fifty-seven laws were amended to give better recognition to same sex couples and, particularly, to recognise the equal parenting roles of two lesbian women who have a child using assisted reproductive technology.

Of course, it is not true that two females can procreate and make a child. The document is a complete fabrication of truth. God’s natural laws still require that there is male sperm and female seed. Yes, I know there are other methods scientifically possible, but we haven’t gone that far down the track yet.

The thing is, are we making a mockery of the generally accepted family unit with these sorts of PC decisions?

8 thoughts on “Can a child really have two mums?

  1. This is kind of interesting, because it raises the question of what a birth certificate is supposed to document. The full ACL article points out that a parenting order can be legally obtained, giving a non-genetic parent equal parenting rights and responsibilities. So what is the birth certificate actually for?

    Birth certificates as far as I know are used as records going back over generations, to trace genetic ancestry. What happens when a child is born to a mother who has broken up with the child’s father and has married a different man? She is giving birth to his step child. Is he then listed on the certificate as the child’s father, or does he need to get a parenting order?

    I guess if a birth certificate is supposed to be a true record and proof of genetic heritage, it should do so, and if two mothers are listed, it should be clear which is the genetic mother. That could be important at some time in the future. The child needs to know the truth, and that does not diminish the love between a non genetic parent and the child.

    I think it is important for all sorts of reasons, including genetic heritage, inheritances, etc, to know what the genetic lineage is where possible. I understand with adopted or IVF kids that it may be restricted due to privacy issues.

    I’d be interested to find out if currently a non-genetic opposite sex parent can be listed legally on a birth certificate. If they cannot, I don’t see why this should change.

    As for making a mockery of the generally accepted family unit – I don’t think it does. In a sense, it is showing a desire to be part of an accepted family unit; a natural human desire.

  2. Its rather about MONEY my love!-gasp!-shock!

    Imagine some kid turning up one day on the doorstep of a pathetic seed-provider and trying to ‘get’ something from ‘dad’!- well, I guess he may have had some exotic historical background or lineage to share, but there is certainly ZERO commitment to the poor kid!

    -The legislation in English-based Law is most generally about ‘rights of property’ (outrage!), so this denies even the remotest material contact with dear ‘ Dad’.

    Now, how serious are women when they say stupid things like “Sean Connery is the Worlds Sexiest Man!”- I, as a proud and strident [though rather ugly] member of my sex sometimes feel concerned that Women would love to extract massive numbers of copies out of ‘Tom Cruise’, ‘Tom Selleck’ , ‘James Bond’ or whoever happens to be flavour of the Month!

    -Its disgusting!-‘was Kinsey right?!’ [its creepy, but he was, technically.]

    However, on a serious note what is of deep concern to me is what I believe Ive learned from John Eldredge [ author-“Wild at Heart”-outstanding work]; that its in the real, interpersonal role that a Father plays, where a little boy or girl gets their ‘affirmation of identity.’

    The guys Ive known who didnt have a dad [and my own was no ‘Mr Brady’, I have to say], really suffered deep identity crisis and self-doubt, and this is pretty true of the abused sons Ive met.

    Ah, but what do we say of the sons and daughters of ‘Sapphic Love’ eh?, or ‘Deliberate single Motherhood’?—well, ‘there’s nothing like having a Guy around!’:

    The strong physical presence of a Male in growing up is something that every kid needs to be able to gravitate-to or be able to deal with at least; a kid will instinctively seek a Father-figure even where that person is not their genetic-stock, just as people do who have grown up ‘without a mum’, ‘Grandma’ or whoever.

    “The thing is, are we making a mockery of the generally accepted family unit with these sorts of PC decisions?”- not really a ‘mockery’, strictly speaking; yet this does not appear to build a very ‘strong’ Society- this is more the point.

    ‘Strong’?- Precisely!; Ive met far too many psychologically messed-up adults from one-sex family, so this is merely a practical observation. One wonders that our PC world does not provide more empirical stats. to confirm or rebuke such an observation.

    [This, even without bringing Generational-sin issues into the discussion; because of what the child will see/hear/do as they grow up in single-sex family; I take it for granted these mums will not be interested in what ‘God the Father’ would have to say, anyway!]


  3. How many divorced Christians are there? Divorced and re-married and destroying kids’ lives. Not to mention the messed up lives of people attending churches.

    Get your own house in order before you judge non-Christians.

    And while you’re getting your house in order, how about telling the world which denomination has the most accurate grasp of truth.

    You’ve had over 2000 years to get all this right. How much more time do you need?

  4. “How many divorced Christians are there? Divorced and re-married and destroying kids’ lives. Not to mention the messed up lives of people attending churches.

    Get your own house in order before you judge non-Christians.
    And while you’re getting your house in order, how about telling the world which denomination has the most accurate grasp of truth.
    You’ve had over 2000 years to get all this right. How much more time do you need?”

    Unfortunately, the church has adapted to the ways of the world to win people to God. In doing so we have allowed the world’s anthom “SMP’ to come marching in through our doors. The church’s job is to help fix broken families and relationships as the world spirals out of control in immorality and indulges in witchcraft, sorcery, delusions, lies, pride and belief that all man can be God.

    Also. I have seen more broken and unstable marriages and just divorcees get saved and start coming to church because only God came to rescue the individual from their circumstances. It was the world that lied to them in the beginning. We pick up the pieces. More relationships are on the rocks as non-believers come believers to seek help. However, the bible does allow divorce as God knows that we are weak as human beings with our promises and ways.

    We encourage people not to live in delusion and if people had any idea the power and discipline the Holy Spirit has to offer, the less bound by sin the world will be in.

  5. We have no mandate to judge non-Christians.

    We have no mandate to force our ways upon them, or anyone.

    We do have a mandate to examine our own body, the church, and ourselves.

    My problem with the religious right is that they seem to think they should legislate their morality for those who have not been born again. Being born again is an internal thing, and can’t be forced upon people. Even God has not ‘legislated’ morality for those who are born again – the law is written on our hearts not enshrined in government.

    The issue of whether children should be deliberately born into a situation with two same sex parents is not necessarily a Christian one. However, judging those non-believing same sex parents is not something Christians are entitled to do.

  6. I don’t think we can necessarily claim that Christian marriages are more successful than non-Christian ones. I don’t know the stats. But I’ve seen many divorces in churches, and a high ratio of pastors marriages fail, for a variety of reasons.

    Plus, sometimes in churches, people will avoid divorce because of appearance and stigma (the world’s values as S&P put it), while allowing abuses within the marriage, or other issues, to remain undealt with.

    Of course this is not what Christ wants for us, and is not what the Bible teaches marriage should be. When churches value appearances, including their own reputations, more than people, a lot of problems will not be assisted to resolve.

    God hates divorce. He also hates violence within a marriage. He also hates domination within a marriage.

    So while I’d agree that the body of Christ when it is working as the body of Christ will assist healing and deliverance from many many issues, when it is _not_ working as the body of Christ, and values appearances over love, etc, it will not help people effectively at all.

  7. Ah, beautiful David,

    Instead of being Nihilistic, why dont you take up the art of ancient Slingshotting?

    It will be a great way for you to connect up to the ‘real’ side of being a human; maybe some manual shepherding and harp-playing too; try singing songs of something to the ‘unity’ of whatever-it-Is thats out there, and you may yet reconnect with your namesake, the ‘superstar’ of god. Its a zany way of me not-kidding with you.

    – Youre right in asking your questions above, though you’re incredibly close to the answers yourself, Im sure; Ive been reading some of your other stuff, and youre in an interesting place.

    ‘Christians’ are just humans- I seem to be spending most of my time trying to persuade ‘my brothers’ to come back at physical-life from the opposite direction; it seems we’ve all got to get ‘very real’ with what’s good-& I for one am bored to death with armchair theologians!

    You see, if we dont believe that words have any value, then the scripture is nothing, and not-binding; but the Bible says of itself “The sum of Thy word is Truth, and all thy righteous ordinances are everlasting-“—so this is why our guys are wrestling with the stuff.

    Ive never been able to fault the Bibles effect on my life-yeh, Ive had heaps of problems with Christian churches and the crazy plethora of interpretations, but with Jesus himself as a person of present help?- absolutely, never, ever!

    Wise question about the Stats Ravingpente;-Stats!, Stats!= a measure of righteousness or correctness in this world?
    I thank heaven I have a believing wife & kids; nope, no guarantees, but I feel safe, and we really struggle together to do what we believe; All that practical stuff I described above, I demo. on my own babies, and ‘gods-way’ has been working beyond belief.

    Have fun all ,


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