When Leaven Invades Church

The heretical Bill Johnson is coming to Australia to speak at C3’s Presence Conference:
He’s also speaking at Dayspring.

When Heaven Invades Earth 2011

Only when the Kingdom of Heaven invades our earthly reality will we see the church equipped to live “on earth as it is in Heaven”. Bill Johnson is one of the leading practitioners in the area of supernatural healing and he believes that we, as Christians, have been called to usher in the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth.

This conference will continue to prepare the church and enable us to live Grace-filled lives, empowered by God’s Spirit and experiencing an outpouring of Kingdom authority and faith.

Teddy found this article of Bill Johnson speaking on the heretical ElijahList.

Bill Johnson

Bill Johnson:”Learning to Host the Presence”

One of the greatest privileges in life is to learn to be a person that God will rest upon. He already lives in every born again Believer. But He doesn’t rest upon all of us. One way I like to say it is, “He is in me for my sake, but He is upon me for yours.” When He is upon us, it especially changes others around us. Jesus modeled this lifestyle in the story of His baptism in water.

When Jesus was baptized, He came out of the water, the Heavens opened, the Father spoke, and then the Holy Spirit came upon Him as a dove and remained. “John testified saying, ‘I have seen the Spirit descending as a dove out of Heaven, and He remained upon Him'” (John 1:32). If, in the natural, I have a dove sitting on my shoulder and I want to go about life without it flying away, how am I going to live? Every step would be with the dove in mind.

As we become faithful in learning how to host the presence of the Lord, it is important to understand that there is a tension between two realities: He has been given to us without measure, yet what we enjoy on a daily basis has been “measured” to us according to our faithfulness. In other words, we have access to the unlimited measure of God’s presence, but He doesn’t entrust Himself to untrustworthy people. All of the measurements are set up on our end of the equation. He typically entrusts us with the measure of the presence we are willing to jealously guard.

We are to become His resting place—the place from which the exploits of Heaven are accomplished. For when the Lord rests upon a person, there is actually an atmospheric shift that takes place wherever that person goes. How do you think Peter’s shadow healed people? Our shadow will always release whatever overshadows us. When we learn to host the presence of the Lord, we get more breakthroughs by accident than ever used to happen on purpose. That is a possibility for every Believer every day.

One of the conflicts we face in learning to host the presence is sometimes found in the very lessons we learned from the previous seasons. Believe it or not, those principles sometimes war against the actual presence of the Lord upon us. We are to use principles to plan by, but we must learn to live from the presence. And if there’s a conflict between the two, presence always wins out over principle.

For example, I may be accustomed to aggressively pursuing the will of God for my life. My key verse might be Matthew 11:12, “and the violent take it by force.” Living by principle has me apply what I have learned up to this point—violent faith. But in this story, the presence of God may be leading me to “receive the Kingdom as a child” (Luke 18:17). If you live entirely by principles only, you will make assumptions in certain moments and seasons that are entirely based on Scripture, but they will be in conflict with the Spirit. In this example, both violent faith and childlike faith are Biblical. It is the Holy Spirit who knows how we are to respond in each particular season or in a given situation.

We are supposed to be well grounded in what God has said so we can discern what He is saying. It is the presence of God that gives me access to continuous ongoing faith, because faith comes by hearing, not having heard. “So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God” (Romans 10:17). Learning to host the presence of God provides the atmosphere of the heart where faith becomes natural and normal.

Let’s commit ourselves to become the resting place of God.

Bill Johnson
Bill Johnson Ministries

bjm.org and ibethel.org

55 thoughts on “When Leaven Invades Church

  1. I found an error on presenceconference.com.

    Dear! Dear! They are not the best representatives of God if their excellence is that poor.

  2. What a load of fluff!! Why do Christians write in a language of fluff? Why not write simple stuff that people can understand and learn from? Or is it a case of “Spiritual Masturbation” or “Who has the bigger…..”

    When we learn to host the presence of the Lord, we get more breakthroughs by accident

    accident??? Host?? What the…
    Now correct me if I am wrong but it was not the shadow or even his presence that healed the person, it was their faith. Just like the women with the issue of blood, it was not the touch/ Jesus’ clothes etc but that she had faith that even just touching Jesus would heal her. Same as Peters shadow etc..

    Now finally can someone actually explain this “host” comment?

  3. no … it’s just mumbo jumbo that is meant to sound impressive and “super-spiritual”.

    Look how cool I am. I am sooooooooo anointed.

    Oh, and we aren’t meant to question or even think. We are to just accept what is said without reference to the Bible. i.e. tossed about by every wind of doctrine.

  4. Here’s yesterday’s talk about false teachers.
    “Can We Cooperate With False Teachers?”

    http://www.crosstalkamerica.com/ Jan 7 2011

    Also I don’t like the use of the word presence because it sounds so impersonal. Why doesn’t Johnson say Holy Spirit (Himself)?

  5. @ Joey – Ingrid Schlueter said she was doing that program on my FB page today, was looking forward to hearing it. Thanks for reminding me…

  6. Had to type this out teddy! From Lakewood Baptist church’s (Delafield WI) constitution:

    * we believe we are to reprove apostates, rather than recognize them
    * to rebuke rather than to reason with them
    * to reject rather than receive or unite with them
    * we believe loyalty to Christ also demands separation from those groups or individuals content to walk with or tolerate religious unbelief.

  7. That was posted up on FB by Fusion Church in New Zealand, they didn’t appreciate my commenting on their “delusion”, though it was truly done with kindness. 🙂 Yes, most definitely with kindness!

    Got a chance to answer some great questions before the pastrix blocked me! Some people really want truth, even when they inadvertently get caught up in deception.

  8. I haven’t joined up on facebook teddy. I never want to be at risk of a certain ex tracking me down. Yes he was that bad. :-(-

  9. Yes, I have read that link, a lot of good links on the sidebar as well.

    From conversations today with the Fusion Church pastrix, she simply couldn’t get past my having been caught up in that craziness and walking away from it. She couldn’t argue against my “experience” as a former charismaniac! Her husband came on and we started a reasonable biblical dialogue and suddenly she closed the site down, sent me a private rebuke about my not accepting the “angels singing” ….oh well.

    Your caution about FB is certainly wise under the circumstances!

  10. It’s interesting why isn’t he in the pool, he’s the one in control telling everyone what to do, and just watching them and giving instructions. It’s like a game. Watching this is highly disturbing.

  11. Like watching a hypnosis show. Sorry, God forgive me if I’m wrong. But my conclusion after watching this and being in meetings where

  12. … this happens, I don’t think it’s the Holy Spirit OR demonic. Just Christians playing around.
    Same goes for Benny Hinn’s coat.

  13. ahh the glory pool, what a joke! I have been ‘involved’ in helping usher people in one of these things and it gave me goosebumps, not the ‘oh this is awesome’ but the hinky goosebumps….

    I have personally never seen anyone (or heard of anyone) get healed or anything useful from being involved in one of these glory pools. Agree with churchman just a bunch of idiots playing church…

  14. @ joey – you are often postings sites I visit regularly “Greycoats” being one of them.

    Here’s an interesting development. On this attached podcast around the 55min mark, Chuck Smith, leader of the Calvary Chapel movement answers a distraught mother’s plea for spiritual advice about her “in utero” conjoined twins. His advice? Abortion.

    [audio src="http://www.kwve.com/podcasts/01%20Pastor%27s%20Perspective%2002_08_11.m4a" /]

  15. @ teddy – yes I have quite a few discernment links type in my old favourites folders.

    I tried to load that podcast but the realplayer interfered with it. That is terrible advice! What did the Mum say?

  16. The mother is distaught, she doesn’t want to have an abortion, the doctors are telling her to, (she has a 2 year daughter, and husband). The twins have 2 heads, 1 body with complications, that they will die anyway at full term. Chuck Smith wrongly assumes the mother’s life is complicated by the pregnancy, though it’s not what she says. He tells her she can ask God to forgive her after she has the abortion!

    I have seen a documentary with 2 young girls living happy lives with the same condition.

    It’s incredibly sad, not a position any of us want to deal with.

    I knew a couple that were told early in the pregnancy via ultrasound the baby didn’t have a brain (anencephaly), and wouldn’t live after birth. They held out believing for a miracle, but delivered a beautiful little boy who died almost immediately. They held him and were able to grieve and leave him in the Lord’s care.

  17. Chuck Smith is losing the plot and needs to be put in a home where he has no access to internet, phone, or any other media…

  18. 1. That was incredibly thoughtless of Chuck Smith to say something like that to a grieving mother anticipating her babies’ death already.
    2. I am amazed that a CHRISTIAN minister would tell another christian to abuse God’s grace.
    3. As someone who had an abortion when I was a teenager – according to the world’s eyes with very valid medical and personal reasons – I can say from my heart all the logic and rationalisations in the world e.g. “but they were going to die any way” will not remove the self-hatred and guilt that mother will go through if she takes his so-called “advice”.

  19. @Glittergirl. Yeah, just suggestion. But it’s good for people to laugh I suppose. I’m sure lots of people who were in that clip felt refreshed, joyful, and maybe had a renewed sense of love for God etc etc. But as Jermayn points out, are there real miracles taking place?

  20. Just listened to the Chuck Smith thing. And I’m baffled.

    All I can think is that Chuck is not really with it anymore. Can’t understand why he would answer the way he did. Especially coming up with the parallel of the adulterous woman??

    Time to think about retirement.

  21. Here’s the latest Youtube clip of Chuck Smith’s audio with accompanying footage of the twins living with one body….

  22. @ churchman, I’m sure they would go away happy, but I could never take anyone to the church. They would think we had lost our mind.

  23. @ Churchman – look at Paul’s final charge to Timothy

    “Chapter 3:10 You, however, know all about my teaching, my way of life, my purpose, faith, patience, love, endurance, 11 persecutions, sufferings—what kinds of things happened to me in Antioch, Iconium and Lystra, the persecutions I endured. Yet the Lord rescued me from all of them. 12 In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, 13 WHILE EVILDOERS AND IMPOSTERS WILL GO FROM BAD TO WORSE, DECEIVING AND BEING DECEIVED. 14 But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, 15 and how from infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.”

    Verse 13 “While evildoers and imposters will go from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.”

    Watching the “glory pool” reminded me of that scripture. Where is the biblical precedent for what we see? Again do we use experience to validate a sense of God’s presence and love when His Word assures us of that very thing, regardless of what we “feel”?

  24. This is an interesting quote from a conclusion of a book:

    “As the masses are carnal and lost in sin, their judgement is hardly to be taken as an indication of what is right in spiritual things. Psychological appeal is by no means spiritual appeal. Augustine, who had been an ardent devotee of the theatre, was much opposed to it after his conversion. He declared it useless as a teacher of truth, and showed that its appeal is not to the conscience and reason, but to the emotions. A whole audience will often weep over some pathetic scene on a stage, teaching a “lesson,” because of rapport with an actor, not because conscience is responsive in repentance. People go away and live as before, even more hardened
    in the reaction of feelings excited without the awaken
    ing of the spirit. The emotion was only a momentary
    fascination, without any power unto righteousness.
    This is true now of all artificial schemes to draw and impress people. The picturesque and dramatic entertain, but do not convict. “Successful” revival meetings that only stir up temporary response through emotional incitement by dramatic or spectacular appeals may properly be labeled “Successful Seances.”

    Elocution is only a trick of imitative eloquence that
    seeks to impress by fascination rather than to instruct for intelligent conduct. The vociferous bellowings of an ignorant and excited preacher can stir an audience to pious frenzy with empty words, but not to enduring righteousness. The sing-song voice and swaying body of an ignorant “revivalist” can secure hypnotic response to the complete “filling of the altar,” but his hearers keep on living as before.

    Ancient teachers, including Jesus Christ, sat down
    while they addressed audiences. They were not actors,
    nor dramatic orators, nor elocutionary ranters, nor
    acrobatic performers. Truth needs no such support.
    Truth is of integrity, and integrity makes no display of itself, and needs no tricks to emphasize it. It was the pagan Greek orators and dramatists who made such ado over “action” as the essential element in forceful address. A prominent writer on music has said that gesticulation is the first stage of the dance, and the dance is certainly carnal. At its best, gesticulation is psychic and not spiritual in its appeal. In the long run, tricks and trappings of oratory and drama fail as Gospel adjuncts. The Holy Spirit accompanies the plain and simple preaching of the word of God, not the schemes of men. Churches that dramatize religion and indulge in pageantry thereby confess their lack of the Holy Spirit, and seek to get results from substituted psychic appeals.”

    Sounds like it could be written about certain preachers in some 21st century christian churches today, doesn’t it? Google that quote and you will see who that christian author’s book from the early 20th century was warning about….

  25. On the abortion thing, I think there are circumstances when a family has to consider it. When there is no hope of the child living and the mother’s life is in danger, and particularly when there are other children depending on the mother… then it has to be considered carefully.

    It sounded like that family may very well be in that situation.

    Sometimes we have to make difficult decisions in life. Sometimes lives must be sacrificed. Lets pray we dont have to make those decisions, but have compassion for those who do.

    I dont know why some Christians give a free pass to those who decide to sacrifice our young men in a war – often of doubtful validity – but keep a frightened young woman on the hook forever.

  26. @Teddy. I don’t think there was a real “glory pool”. I don’t think there was a demonic pool either.

    But I am sure that the participants will have lots of testimonies about what they felt. And many of them probably “feel” closer to God after it.

    If they aren’t already doing it, don’t be surprised for plain old athiests to start doing the charismania circuit and making money out of it. They are the most gullible, easily deceived group in the world these days.

    (especially when if anyone had any doubt that the Holy Spirit was really behind what was happening that would be told not to think.)

    Sad days.

  27. Absoloutely!, dont you all see the obvious parallels between warfare and soldiers losing their lives with abortion????

  28. Old Tweet from Bill Johnson:

  29. Well … maybe BJ was thinking about the Church in Acts …

    Oh … hang on a bit … actually, didn’t they have the same book that Jesus and Pater and Paul and John quote freely … let me see, what was it? Oh yes, don’t we call that the Old Testament these days?

  30. This is one of Bill Johnson’s prophets prophesying in his church. Notice the ElijahList style of layout:

    I Have Chosen California
    Erica Greve

    “It Is No Accident That I Have Chosen California”

    “It is no accident that I have chosen California. I have begun to do a re-birth in California that reflects the wealth of the natural resources in this state and I have only just begun to develop the natural resources here.

    “Get ready to find new mines, new resources, new groups of fish moving into areas. There will be a re-birth of natural habitats, including habitats for aquatic and marine life — these things will begin to flourish once again. Get ready for a re-birth in this land that will shake — and quake — the foundations that I have already begun to establish in this state.

    “California is Thirsty for Truth”
    “A new chapter was begun in California when Schwarzenegger was sworn in. I have begun to develop a new governmental infrastructure in California. Now is the time to get involved in government and politics on local and state-wide levels. People will begin to seek out your opinions on political and moral issues like never before. Like a bear seeking for honey will be the Californians seeking for righteousness. A new favor will fall upon you to make a difference in every area of daily life. Californians are being stirred for righteousness and for water. They are thirsty for Truth. Get ready and seek My heart on these matters.”

    Get ready for new finds. Just as new resources will be found in the areas throughout the state, also get ready to find new “finds” in people around you. California has already been known world-wide for the quality of its fruit. And, in this same manner, there has been much fruit that the Lord has been cultivating here, and it is time for the new harvest to be picked and shipped off.

    The Lord says, “There have been many that I have sent here to be trained, equipped, and refined. It is now time for them to be released to the nations as the first fruits of what I will do through this state in the future. Then I will send the next wave of those I will equip here and they will come to take the place of those who will be sent out. It is time for the fathers to release the children, to send them out from the nest.”

    “The Season of Promotion”
    The Lord says, “Even the picked-over will be promoted in this season, the ‘not ready’s,’ the ‘bad eggs,’ those who were rejected, and especially the women and the youth. These ones will be among those who will be re-introduced as who they really are and their old limitations and self-doubt will fall off.

    “I am looking for voices . . . I am like a star crying out in the night for those who will follow Me wherever I send them and who will keep their eyes fixed upon me as their sole source of life, of light, and of nourishment. I will be their only provider and they will be My children.”

    Get ready to see people in a whole new way — to see them in a way that you have never seen — and get ready to see people who have been passed over get promoted.

    “Just as the testimony of gold went out from California during the Gold Rush, so have the testimonies of My works that have been taking place in California covered the globe. And just as California’s reputation for having the best fruit, wine, and produce went throughout the Earth, so will the reputation that will be given to those who are released from this state.

    “I am getting ready to release my special ones, my End Times Army, that will cover the globe with signs and wonders and with power. There are many who I brought to California before I sent them out so that they would be released with the My Blue Ribbon Seal of Approval. They will receive and bear My Blue Ribbon Seal of Approval and they will begin to move in a power not yet seen on this Earth. This is My season of promotion,” says the Lord.

    Revelation 21:1-7:

    “Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

    “And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, ‘Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain; for the former things have passed away.’

    “Then He who sat on the throne said, ‘Behold, I make all things new.’ And He said to me, ‘Write, for these words are true and faithful.’

    “And He said to me, ‘It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water freely to him who thirsts. He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be my Son.'”

    by Erica Greve


  31. “I am getting ready to release my special ones, my End Times Army, that will cover the globe with signs and wonders and with power.”

    There have been so many groups and cults whose members have felt special. This end time army thing seems to be really appealing for people doesn’t it?

    This army has been in training for a long time now. Sadly, most of the generals have gone awol or started fighting for the enemy and the signs and wonders are still not to be seen.

    If you’ve been around you’ve heard these kind of prophecies for each year for years now. The only difference is that they are getting longer (maybe it’s the heavier prophetic anointing…..??)
    and they come out with more interesting expressions e.g
    “My Blue Ribbon Seal of Approval”

  32. those people are clearly insane.

    And they just as clearly never read a Bible.

    Jesus promises tough times for Christians towards the end of the age. It’s tough in China and the Middle East and North Africa. It’s getting tough in the UK too.

    Our actual experience fits with what Jesus told us would happen, but we don’t hear this from the NAR. We hear REVIVAL!, End-Times Harvest!, New wine!, God is doing a NEW thing!.

    I am sick and tired of all the false prophecy.


  33. So now that C3 have planted a church in Hong Kong under the care of patrix Mary Simpson (and business manager hubby) where do they go foe leadership advice?
    Mary Simpson tweets………

    .Gr8 start 2 week, attended Bill Johnson conf 4 pastors/leaders ‘creating a culture of honour’. http://yfrog.com/h00g61j
    about 20 hours ago via Yfrog

  34. “It’s difficult to get the same fruit as the early church when we value a book they didn’t have more than the Holy Spirit they did have.”

    That’s just a strange statement.

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