Bill Johnson: The Lords Prayer Reveals God’s Will

Love or wrath?

Whether or not we believe that God is pouring out love or wrath today, or have a positive or negative angle on what God intends for those who want to follow Jesus, it is clear that there are ministries which are preaching that God has come to pour out his grace and that their life will be changed for the better when they accept his free pardon and forgiveness.

To this end, it is clear that one ministry, run by Bill Johnson, has an agenda

…We are out to destroy the works of the devil…

In what is known as the lords prayer, Jesus said clearly and concisely:

“Our Father in Heaven, hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done on earth as it is in Heaven.”

(Matthew 6:9-10).

The will of God is simply this: “On earth as it is in Heaven.” Isn’t it refreshing? When we pray, “Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done,” we’re praying for the King’s dominion and will to be realized right here, right now. That is a life-transforming, paradigm-shattering way to “do” normal Christianity. What is free to operate in Heaven – Joy, peace, wisdom, health, wholeness, and all the other good promises we read about in the Bible – Should be free to operate here on this planet, in your home, your church, your business, and your school. What is not free to operate there – sickness, disease, spiritual bondage, and sin – should not be free to operate here, period. We are out to destroy the works of the devil (1 John 3:8). It’s an awesome way to live!

When we make this our primary understanding of God’s will, the other areas that trouble us so much will seem to sort themselves out (Matt. 6:33).

When we make this our mission, lives are set free, bodies are restored, darkness lifts from people’s minds, the rule of the enemy is pushed back in every way imaginable. Businesses grow healthy, relationships flower again, people re-connect with their calling and purpose in life, churches grow, and cities feel the effects of having the kingdom flourishing within them. Energy is freed up for Kingdom works in ways I have never seen before. Things happen regularly that are so extraordinary it’s like stepping into the pages of a good novel. But it’s not a made-up lifestyle; it’s the lifestyle for which we were made.

There are other ministries which are more severe in their approach to the Christian life, promoting austerity, persecution, lack and even loss as the prize for receiving Christ.

Does God have a positive agenda for people, or is he already releasing wrath into the the earth as a precursor to the Day of the Lord, when he will release his vengeance?

 

Posted by Steve


42 thoughts on “Bill Johnson: The Lords Prayer Reveals God’s Will

  1. I think this is a dangerous doctrine – the idea that as Christians we should always be free of sin, bondage, sickness etc.

    ” What is not free to operate there – sickness, disease, spiritual bondage, and sin – should not be free to operate here, period.”

    The fact is that everyone will experience some sorrow, sickness and disease in this life. Everyone will experience some kind of misfortune, sickness or death of friends and family – sometimes untimely – and everyone will continue to sin in some way. This is our lot in this world.

    The idea that some people can get a free pass from this (super pastors and apostles?), and that we can be like them if we follow their methods is quite appealing, beautiful and completely wrong.

    The prayer “Thy kingdom come” is an imploration, not a statement of the current situation.

  2. @wazza2

    “I think this is a dangerous doctrine – the idea that as Christians we should always be free of sin, bondage, sickness etc.”

    You need to not just read your bible, but you need to understand it. What is your response to Galations 5:1 “IN [this] freedom Christ has made us free [and completely liberated us]; stand fast then, and do not be hampered and held ensnared and submit again to a yoke of slavery [which you have once put off].”

    How about Romans 6:18 “You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness.”

    And then there’s Psalm 103 “Bless the Lord, O my soul,
    And forget not all His benefits: Who forgives all your iniquities,
    Who heals all your diseases, Who redeems your life from destruction,Who crowns you with lovingkindness and tender mercies, Who satisfies your mouth with good things,”

    So. going to apologise to Bill Johnson now wazza?

  3. And do you go to the doctors at all? Or wait for healing from the Lord?

    Some parents have let their kids die while waiting for the Lord to heal them. The government calls that manslaughter.

  4. Yes, could I ask you Mr Roundhouse, do you ever commit any sort of sin? ( this includes sins of commission and omission )

    Have you been sick, or even a bit poorly since you were saved?

    If you can answer an absolute negative to these questions, then I will apologise to Mr Johnson.

  5. Hey, don’t take issue with me, take issue with the bible. I only copied and pasted what the bible says – you know, that book that you insist Bill Johnson and Phil Pringle et al ignore? The one that you insist you know back to front and so confidently announce that you know more of than those guys? Take it up with the authors, not me.

  6. No, sorry I am taking it up with you.

    Do you believe absolutely in the interpretation of the Bible you have given?

    If so, how is it working out for you? It must be heaven on earth? I’m quite jealous.

    Your moral and physical perfection must be quite a witness to others around you. I am very interested in this whole area.

  7. @wazza2

    “No, sorry I am taking it up with you.

    Do you believe absolutely in the interpretation of the Bible you have given?”

    It says what it says. Ignore it if you want. Only, by you selectively ignoring scripture that doesn’t suit your own experiences or theology, anything you say from this point about the so-called errors in the teaching of Bill Johnson, Phil Pringle and Brian Houston will be tempered by your own refusal to take the bible as it’s written.

  8. Why is Bill Johnson wearing glasses, hair going grey? Body wearing out, slowly dying as we all are (as long as the Lord “tarries”) – is it working for him?

  9. So, judging by what I am reading from wazza, Bones, and now you Margot, none of you believe the bible. Interesting…….

  10. @Bones

    “Great way to avoid answers.”

    You’re shooting the messenger here. I posted scriptures that prove wazza’s argument to be false. Nothing more. The onus isn’t on me to tell you what I believe or not. It’s not about me. The onus is on him and you to explain what is wrong with those scriptures. Either they are true or they are false. Which is it?

  11. @ Roundhouse – what is interesting is your ongoing ‘inability’ to answer the questions. (And I don’t believe the bible? That’s interesting, considering my defense of the inerrancy of scripture on this blog.)

    You come on and tell how judgemental we are, then proceed to judge us?

    Previously on the other post, I asked the question, how do we practice discernment if we do not ‘judge’ ministries since the bible ‘exhorts us to beware of evildoers and false prophets and to avoid those who practice all kinds of evil’?

  12. @Roundhouse,

    “You need to not just read your bible, but you need to understand it.”

    Oh the irony!

  13. Apparently Paul didnt understand either:
    15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[a] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.

    He also talked about a thorn in the flesh.

    Dr Roundhouse, would you give the same advice to Paul. After all you have conclusively proved your doctrine with several proof-texts.

    Read your Bible, Paul.

  14. @Margot

    “(And I don’t believe the bible? That’s interesting,
    considering my defense of the inerrancy of scripture
    on this blog.)”

    Yes, it struck me as interesting too.

    So do you, or do you not believe that those scriptures I posted are saying what it appears they are saying?

  15. @ Roundhouse – I guess you will have to tell me/us what YOU think they appear to be saying?

    And I do have a view, but also a very busy weekend ahead! 🙂

  16. So, is anyone going to answer my initial question, or are you just going to keep pointing at unicorns? Can I take that to mean you have no answer?

  17. @Margot

    “I guess you will have to tell me/us
    what YOU think they appear to be saying?”

    I think they are saying what they are saying. There is no ambiguity. It’s very clear for those who choose to see.

  18. @Dr Roundhouse,

    “I think they are saying what they are saying. There is no ambiguity. It’s very clear for those who choose to see.”

    That would be one of *my* lines you’re using there.

    If you persist with plagiarising, I will have no option but to commence proceedings with a view to having you stripped of your Doctorate. You have been warned!

  19. Hey, don’t take issue with me, take issue with the bible. I only copied and pasted what the bible says – you know, that book that you insist Bill Johnson and Phil Pringle et al ignore? The one that you insist you know back to front and so confidently announce that you know more of than those guys? Take it up with the authors, not me.

    I’ve got no idea who this clown is or you for that matter so it has nothing to do with if he knows the Bible or not. He is though, clearly a nutbag, as are you.

  20. Honestly what percentage of diseases are healed by God? Anyone? 1%, 0.1%. Yes I know it happens but with the regularity of someone winning Lotto.

    If we’re to take Prof Roundhose’s interpretation then he has just proven the Bible to be redundant.

  21. @ MRCS Bones (because it seems appropriate to bestow that further title on you) – either that or Dem Bones, Dem Bones.

    I wonder if Roundhouse dares pray a prayer with “if it is Your Will” attached?

    Does he always know God’s will? Do any of us know His infinite purposes and plans, apart from revealed scripture, subject as we are to our our finite, limited minds.

    Though I can admit to not always being happy in the circumstance or illness that I may find myself in, I certainly know enough about Him to trust Him.

  22. I don’t believe God wants people to be sick.

    I look after my body so that I don’t get sick, if I got sick I would pray, believe, and go to the doctor.

    And I don’t want my kids getting sick. When they get sick, I don’t think that God wants them to be sick. I do what I can to get them better.

    Very simple to me.

  23. btw, if I have a headache, I don’t do nothing and think if it’s God’s will I’ll get better. I live on the assumption that it’s not God’s will for me to have a headache, and I take a tablet if it doesn’t go away.

    And I think Christians should go into the world and do what they can do alleviate sickness, poverty, suffering.

    As for your question Steve, I don’t live assuming that the world is getting worse and God’s wrath is increasing. It would have been a mistake to think that way in 1812, or 1612. So I don’t think that way now.

    So I’m on your side of the debate.

    EXCEPT, that if you read what Bill Johnson wrote there, it sounds like everything is just dandy. But as Margot said, he wears glasses – and I bet that if you went to his church there would be plenty of people who are sick and dying. And many who are still sick no matter how many feathers and gold dust they’ve caught.

    (and I speak as an insider).

  24. I think wazza started us off with the wrong premise, and Bones sustains it, whilst Margot feeds it.

    They assume that what is being said is that when a person is saved he or she is immediately immune to the world. That is not either true or being implied.

    What is being said is that there are two kingdoms that are hostile to one another, darkness and light.

    Jesus has given believers the mandate to usher in, through preaching the gospel of repentance, the Kingdom of Heaven in a world which is manipulated and controlled by darkness, with the resulting corruption of sin, which has introduced the curses of sickness, poverty, death and destruction.

    When we pray for God’s will to be done in earth as it is in heaven, we are agreeing with God’s purposes for the ages to bring everything under Christ’s feet, we are confessing our determination the enter into his cause to bring change and redemption to the world.

    Of course sickness, lack, death and corruption remain in the earth. That is what we are at war against. The gospel brings the answers to pain and suffering for the lost and for those who are saved, the power of the kingdom and the grace of God, but not all will believe and not all will receive, or accept the truth of the influence of heaven on the earth to those who do believe.

    There are many who will even suffer persecution and even death for the sake of the gospel, so it is not a matter of saying that being saved is a cure-all for the corruption that is on the planet, but that the kingdom of heaven offers a better way of living and the potential for the cures of the ills of the world.

    And, of course, we want the peace, joy and righteousness of he Kingdom of Heaven to be brought into our world. That is not a guarantee that everyone will be instantly cured of their ills, but that there is always hope for the afflicted, and the opportunity for all to be saved who will believe and accept Jesus.

    There is a greater Kingdom. It is being preached. Lives are being changed.

    Calling the Kingdom of Heaven ‘dangerous’ and denying its power is the biggest danger.

  25. @ Steve – “I think wazza started us off with the wrong premise, and Bones sustains it, whilst Margot feeds it.”

    Tone it down, Steve. No wonder things get out of hand on this blog.

  26. Margot,
    Tone it down, Steve.

    Sure Margot. Will you be asking Bones, Greg, Zorro and wazza to do the same? Or yourself? Is this how you dealt with the five brothers? Stir things up then tell them to calm down with a sisterly tone? LOL! 😀 Hmmm!
    ________________________________________

    When John was in prison he sent his disciples to ask Jesus if He was the Coming One, or if there would be another. Jesus said, “Go and tell John the things which you hear and see: The blind see and the lame walk; the lepers are cleansed and the deaf hear; the dead are raised up and the poor have the gospel preached to them. And blessed is he who is not offended because of Me.”

    He told them the Kingdom had arrived. This is God’s will. We can know God’s will. We can pray with confidence. We are not in the dark regarding what God has for us. There is so much scripture to demonstrate this.

    Luke 4
    8 “The Spirit of the LORD is upon Me, Because He has anointed Me To preach the gospel to the poor; He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim liberty to the captives And recovery of sight to the blind, To set at liberty those who are oppressed;
    19 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD.”

    That is God’s will. That is the Kingdom of God, or the KIngdom of Heaven as Matthew calls it. That is what is replacing the kingdoms of the world. That is what we are called to usher in in the name of Jesus.

    As fr knowing God’s will, we can discover his will for us in his Word, and pray in the name of Jesus.

    1 John 5
    14 Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us.
    15 And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him.

    1 Corinthians 2
    12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

  27. Nicely said Steve. And so true.

    The problem with wazza, Bones, Zorro and Margot is that they are literalists, either by virtue of their attending denominational, law-loving and spiritually dead churches, or, methinks, just to be downright difficult. They usually follow the letter of the law, rather than seeking the spiritual truths behind what is written, but in this case, because the text is so plain and easy to understand, yet flies in the face of their own earthly experiences, they go all “no, you are” and start with their childish little name-calling and tantrums.

    So, is anyone of you going to attempt to explain why you are so willing to ignore several scriptures that don’t support your own beliefs and experiences?

    Let me re-post them, in case you’ve forgotten what they said again, along with wazza’s false assumptions:

    “I think this is a dangerous doctrine – the idea that as Christians we should always be free of sin, bondage, sickness etc.

    Galations 5:1 “IN [this] freedom Christ has made us free [and completely liberated us]; stand fast then, and do not be hampered and held ensnared and submit again to a yoke of slavery [which you have once put off].”

    Romans 6:18 “You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness.”

    Psalm 103 “Bless the Lord, O my soul,
    And forget not all His benefits: Who forgives all your iniquities,
    Who heals all your diseases, Who redeems your life from destruction,Who crowns you with lovingkindness and tender mercies, Who satisfies your mouth with good things,”

  28. Actually, Roundhouse, Bones and wazza would disagree with you concerning being literalists. They are liberalists, although Bones is showing distinct signs of being a closet catholic.

    Margot, Bones has suggested that you are retarded. Will you be asking him to tone down, or is that OK? LOL!

    Bones
    Catholics who pray to saints and Mary are as retarded as Christians who believe in 6 day creation.

    https://signposts02.wordpress.com/2012/03/17/is-roman-catholic-doctrine-biblical-the-immaculate-conception/#comment-30598

    Hilarious!

  29. Yes, Steve just because you can point and snicker at the Catholics, don’t think that some of your beliefs are any less retarded.

  30. In the space of two weeks, the leader of one of the most respected evangelical organizations in the world committed suicide while being investigated for child sex abuse, the ex-president of Oral Roberts University who have a no drinking policy was caught for DUI driving 30 miles over the limit, and all over the world christians are busy scoring points and attacking each other and their churches on blogs.

    I think I’ll go pray “thy kingdom come, thy will be done” a zillion times.

    Have a great weekend guys.

  31. Just going on to the Bill Johnson article. It really is a very Western centred article. The heart of the kingdom of God are the poor and the poorest on this planet are in Africa, Asia and South America where disease, corruption and famine are rampant. You wanna know what God’s will and what the kingdom is, it’s over there.

  32. I’d say the will of God is not to have sex with kiddies. Maybe that’s a bit too hard to understand.

    While we’re most aware of the Catholic sex abuse cases, this sort of thing is not limited to Catholic religious leaders. There was of course the Ted Haggard scandal: Ted Haggard, then president of the National Association of Evangelicals, a rabid homophobe and anti-gay activist Ted Haggard had been seeing a gay prostitute for years. Then there is Bill Gothard, who has apparently sexually harassed dozens of girls and women ages 15 to 24 for decades even as he ran, and continues to run, the Institute for Basic Life Principles, which promises to create strong values and emphasizes the value of “sexual purity.”

    And then there’s this just out: VOM’s executive director for the past twenty-five years, Tom White, has committed suicide. Why? Because he was in the middle of being investigated for sexually abusing a ten-year-old girl. The VOM statement on his death states “none of those in leadership at VOM, including our Board of Directors, were aware of these allegations at the time of Tom’s death.” No apology, just “not us!”

    I grew up in a home where The Voice of the Martyrs was always prominently displayed for bathroom reading, and sometimes read aloud over breakfast. For a long time I wore VOM’s “BASIC” bracelet (Brothers And Sisters In Christ). I looked up to the organization, thought it was godly, thought it had good intentions and did good work. And then this. I’m feeling a bit disenchanted at the moment.

    Now of course, this sort of thing is absolutely not limited to religious leaders or religious individuals. But these sorts of cases contain something more because of their blatant hypocrisy. Catholic priests sexually abuse children…while claiming to be God’s mediators on earth. Ted Haggard preached against gay rights and condemning homosexuality from his influential evangelical pulpit…while seeing a gay prostitute. Bill Gothard runs a ministry dedicated to raising “virtuous” and “pure” young people…while sexually harassing his own students in that ministry. Tom White ran a ministry dedicated to Christians persecuted for their faith across the world…while sexually abusing a ten-year-old girl. The hypocrisy burns.

    http://www.patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfeminism/2012/04/the-hypocrisy-burns-voice-of-the-martyrs-tom-white.html

  33. I think you’ve been spending too much time over at GripSocks, Bones. You’re starting to have that same bitter edge towards Christians and Pastors. Lance has that effect on people after a while. Sowing and reaping and all that.

    I think SM has the right idea.

    This getting far too personal and anti-christian.

    Not worth it.

  34. @ Steve – given the time difference we all share, I would be up all night responding to Bones’ unfortunate use of the word “retarded”. Hardly a politically correct term these days, especially if there are disabled people living in your own vicinity (like our very precious neighbour’s son).

    Being a literal 6 day creationist, it’s always good to know that we are in good company. From Tim Challies blog today….

    “Simply stated, creation refers to everything that exists that has not always existed. It refers to all that God has brought into existence, which is everything apart from God himself—including angels and, eventually, Satan and his demons—since God is the one and only thing that has never been created.

    There are a variety of ways to understand how creation happened—or at least how it has come to look like it does now. While these views can differ slightly or substantially, all Bible-believing Christians will agree on the following points:

    1) God created it by, through, and for Christ.

    •For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. (Colossians 1:16)

    2) God created it by his word and out of nothing.

    •By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible. (Hebrews 11:3)

    •And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. (Genesis 1:3)

    3) It was corrupted through man’s sin.

    •For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to corruption and obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God. (Romans 8:20-21)

    •And to Adam he said, “Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree of which I commanded you, ‘You shall not eat of it,’ cursed is the ground because of you; in pain you shall eat of it all the days of your life … ” (Genesis 3:17)

    4) It will be replaced with a glorious, new creation when Christ returns.

    •For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth, and the former things shall not be remembered or come into mind. (Isaiah 65:17)

    •Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. (Revelation 21:1)”

    My understanding of Scripture leads me to believe that the world was created in a literal six days, putting me squarely in the traditional 24-hour calendar day view.

  35. @Bones

    From The Age newspaper:

    A VICTORIAN doctor allegedly raped a woman seven times during one night, a jury has been told.
    The woman claiming Arvind Sharma raped her feigned that she had passed out while he allegedly attacked her in an attempt to stop his actions, a Victorian County Court jury heard yesterday.
    Sharma pleaded not guilty to seven counts of rape and three of indecent assault arising from the alleged incident in December 2006 at his Bendigo home. He claims the sex was consensual.

    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/doctor-raped-woman-court-told-20100927-15u43.html#ixzz1twDBdGRe

    So, Bones, I take it you will stop going to any and all doctors now, because, obviously, if one of them raped a women, they must ALL be rapists, right?

  36. You know how sometimes you wake up really early in the morning and you have a thought about something, and you think to yourself “wow, that’s the most brilliant thing I have ever thought”, but as the day progresses you realize that it was actually rather silly? Well my above post needs to be put into that category. When I read Bone’s post, my early morning brain-fog read it to mean that he was saying that because a few catholic priests are pedos, therefore all Christians are as well. Upon re-reading his post, I realize now that it was really about…..actually I still have no idea what it was about, but nonetheless, disregard my response to it.

    However, if you ever do find yourself engaged in a debate with a non-Christian or an atheist who has the attitude that I was ascribing to Bones (and there are plenty out there), you may find what I posted to be of some use.

    Have a great day

  37. @ Roundhouse – Bones is a Christian, if we accept his personal understanding of the redeeming work of Christ.

    A sometimes disagreeable one but a Christian none the less.

  38. Just read this on what I gather is C3’s Facebook or something.

    Presence 2011: Positioning For Power

    Bill Johnson preached on the Person of the Holy Spirit.

    Bill Johnson drew the congregation in further with his message to the Church “to broker or release the presence of the Holy Spirit on the earth.” He reminded the audience that the Holy Spirit was a Person and the Christian life was in essence to illustrate the manifestation of our relationship with the Holy Spirit just as Jesus did during His ministry on earth.

    Johnson stressed Jesus’ humanity—He performed those miracles as a mere mortal and not as God, as most would have thought. It is a compelling revelation that Jesus had set aside His divinity and put on the same restrictions that we as humans have. It was for the purpose of illustrating what man could do when he or she was in a right relationship with God through the Holy Spirit.

    See this is what happens when we don’t have a grasp of theology and Church History. The same heresies Christians fought against are now permissible.

    http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150176338383806

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