Prasch’s Lash-Out On Rick Warren

this one is a tough message from J. Jacob Prasch

IS RICK WARREN THE MEDIA FRIENDLY VOICE FOR THE REGENERATE CHURCH OR FOR THE DEGENERATE CHURCH ?

Rick Warren, whose efforts to turn Evangelical Christianity into a psychologized religion based on marketing with his ‘Purpose Driven’ agenda stunned many who claim to be regenerated bible believing Christians when he appeared on Larry King Live globally offering an apology to the homosexual & lesbian community for his ‘apparent’ opposition to California’s Proposition 8 outlawing legal recognition of same sex marriage. He did this after creating the unambiguous impression he did oppose it. Warren’s hypocrisy or Christ-less treachery appear to know no limits. Yesterday’s theological liberal is today’s supposed ‘Evangelical’.

From his butchering of scripture out of context, to his reliance on Eugene Peterson’s ‘The Message’ which to any biblical Evangelical schooled in New Testament Greek can only be described as an utter bastardization of Holy Writ , Warren has set mew limits to spiritual seduction.

On the basis of scripture, Warren’s translocational hermeneutics in which he literally ‘cuts and pastes’ verses from one book or passage into another to completely change the original meaning demonstrates categorically that Rick Warren is clearly of the devil – an agent of hell dispatched by Satan to destroy what con artist tele-evangelists and ecumenists have not already destroyed of biblical Christianity.

Warren’s perversion of the Gospel where he replaces the biblical centrality of repentance with a consumer friendly instruction not to preach repentance at one time would have left any biblically grounded Christian, and certainly pastor warning others against this deceiver.

His exhortation to avoid end time prophecy, directly contradicting the opposite exhortation of Jesus (Achieved by deleting Acts 1: 6 and replacing it with a cut and pasted insertion of Matthew 24:3) means that he places his instructions above those of God. This is indeed the spirit of anti Christ. Like the Lucifer who whom he is employed and from he takes his orders, Warren likewise in character of Satan in Matthew 4 perverts texts out of context in isolation from co-text to create a distorted pretext. This is the devil, and this is Rick Warren.

Warren joined with Brian Maclaren (who demands a moratorium on debating the morality of homosexuality and lesbianism until the church decides if it is right or wrong) in forwarding Dan Kimbell’s book ; ‘The Emerging Church’, a post modern metaphysical philosophy of mysticism drawing on early medieval monastic spirituality with everything from icons to labyrinths to the ‘lectio divina’. Indeed, a return to the dark ages with no objective biblical compass to determine direction. Maclaren is a by theological definition a Gnostic who says then parables of Jesus should rather be interpreted on the basis of ‘our imagination’. It is Warren’s Purpose Driven lie that is the door into Maclaren’s emergence. What is astounding however is that these sons of Lucifer are portrayed as ‘Evangelicals’, despite they cannot justly claim any subscription to an exegetically biblical Evangelicism.

What is more perverse than this however is that even after Warren’s apologetic backtrack to the homosexual & lesbian community who demand legal recognition of what is biblically an unholy matrimony now claiming he is not against such same sex marriages the backlash from Christians has remained mooted. Christian bookshops continue to sell his Purpose Driven Lie.

Warren spoke at a synagogue but made no proclamation of Jesus as The Messiah as St. Paul and Jesus did when they were invited to synagogues and as others such as David Hocking have done today. Rather he lectured on his Purpose Driven programmatic approach will work to grow synagogues as well as churches. One would ask why anybody would want to help a false Judaism rejecting its own messiah to put more Jews on the path to hell? Yet Warren extends his agenda to other religions as well. Now , and most notably Islam.

Truly Born again Arab believers normally address Jesus as ‘Yesua Hamesa’, but after praying in the name of “Issa’ , (the Islamic name for Jesus who is not the Jesus of The Gospels because Issa is not God’s Son) at Obama’s inaugeration, Warren has gone once more gone further. He has now addressed an Islamic convention organized by Islamic organizations funded by oil money from Saudi Arabia which executes people for becoming Christians. Like Obama, Rick Warren said not a word about human rights abuses , the persecution of Christians throughout the Islamic world, or the rife hatred of Jews even taught to children in moslem schools and madrasses. Persecuted Christians are not on Obama’s agenda, and neither are they on Rick Warren’s. Neither of course did Warren in any sense present the Gospel to these lost souls. It is obvious that we have wicked men like George Bush and Barack Hussein Obamas in The House House because we have wicked men like Rick Warren in the pulpit.

Backslidden nations get the leaders they deserve. So do backslidden churches.

Moslems, unbelieving Jews, and homosexuals & lesbians are not the cardinal problem. These are unsaved people doomed to a Christ-less eternity unless the true church by God’s grace and with God’s help can reach them with the gospel. But what is left of the true church?

For too long it has been sandwiched between one lunatic fringe of ultra Pentecostals and hyper charismatics not knowing the difference between charismata and charismania on one extreme and another lunatic fringe of hyper Calvinistic kooks and cessationists not knowing knowing the difference between reconstructionism and The true Kingdom of God on the opposite pole of the ecclesiastical spectrum. Now the center is being satanically subverted.

If Jesus were not coming, I would become very despondent. But Praise God He is Coming. Now as the faithful remnant strengthens the things that remain the question becomes what our strategy should consist of in the meanwhile. The Lord will indeed show us if we ask Him and He has in a greater sense already showed us doctrinally in broad terms in His Word.

How can The Body of Christ not remove this demonic and highly metastatic cancer from itself but instead watch not only the lost perish but the church progressively rot to death with this auto tolerated malignancy? That demonic cancer is indeed the agenda of Rick Warren & Co.

J.Jacob Prasch/ Moriel

That’s a bit of an eye opener … thoughts?

Bull

Holy Ghost (S)Laughter…

Satanic Revival In Sydney! (Get Drunk & Possessed in Jesus Name!)

I just got a phone call from a friend ten minutes ago. He gave me this website and attempted to play what he was hearing through the telephone. He was an elder of my church, shocked and stressed at what he was seeing.

http://fireitup.com.au/cms/

Five months ago I talked to the pastors of this church warning them about what was coming to Sydney. I wrote reports, e-mails, letters informing them of what was happening. Unfortunately some shook their heads at me thinking I had issues (close friends). But fortunately, the pastor of the church heard what I said, but thought it not right to label specific false teachings, ministries, people or revivals. Instead he did a few sermons on how to discern, how to rightly divide the word of God, understanding interpretations of scripture and testing the words of teachers.

Unfortunately, just up the road, I was going to a cute little church that unfortunately jumped into the Lakeland camp and got swept up, up and away into seeking after signs & wonders, levitation, Crowder, alchemy, dunken glory states, portals, translating and all that creepy new age stuff.

When the pastors of the church started seeing that the ’supernatural’ was what people were wanting, they refused to listen to the word I continually begged them to do: discern. Discernment was never discussed, so I begged other pastors who knew this church well to help take them out from where they were going.

But this is it. Expect delusion to hit hard in Sydney unless the churches are ready to stand up and say “no more”.

The fruit of these kind of movements IS the promotion of doctrines of demons and witchcraft. I have been on the receiving end of these spiritual meetings, and spiritual confusion runs rampant. The religious spirit is steering the movement and pride is shouting from the rooftops that they are the next best thing in Christendom. To them, those against them are heresy-hunters, Spirit-quenchers, problematic, dead boned, religious skeletons, jealous, don’t know God, unsaved, ignorant and deprived.

BTW. You might think to call this revival satanic is a bit did you spot this on their website?

Which Miracle do you want to see your pastor do?

	Levitate while preaching
	Walk through a wall
	Walk on water during a baptism
	Turn communion juice into wine
	Raise a dead person back to lfe
	Go onto the street and evangelise
	Repent of control and allow Holy Spirit to run a mok!

If a pastor is evangelising, then doesn’t that make them an evangelist? I would consider a pastor who defends the flock from this madness to be  a miracle. This is not about JESUS! Just watch the youtube videos provided! No Jesus! Only ‘the power of heaven being unleashed’. Watch 7 minutes of nothing but adults acting like monkeys and weirdos. It’s all about Matt Ford. Not Jesus. Do a word search and you wont find him mentioned! Ooo-OOOOHHH… Shabba shakir SHINGDING!!!

But Jesus must be online somewhere on this website. I just got shabbafied!

One more thing: to identify if a church is tainted by the American Church (or more specifically the KCP), just see if that church runs a school of the supernatural (SOS) or glory schools (GS):

MYSTIC GLORY SCHOOL

Experience the Glory of Heaven in your daily life!

Commencing Tuesday 7th July 2009, we will be starting our 10 week Extreme Glory School . This is an amazing course which will launch you into a whole new realm of Heaven and will cause the Kingdom of Heaven to explode all around you, every where you go.

This school will be held on Tuesday Nights starting at 7pm @ Fire HQ.

Topics Include…

* Experience the Third Heaven, visions, trances, ecstasies, transportation in the Spirit, ascending and descending

* Drinking from the wine barrel of Heaven

* Prophetic Bootcamp, All Can Prophesy & Hearing the voice of God

* History of Christian Mystics and past revivalists

* Operating in the Anointing & Living in the Glory

* Prophetic Prayer, Soaking, contemplative prayer

* 3rd Heaven Intercession

* Who you are as a New Creature in Jesus

* The Person of Holy Spirit, getting to know Him as a friend and God

* The Angelic Realm and working alongside Living Creatures

* The Fire

These classes will no doubt be hijacked by Holy Spirit and subject to change. All classes will be available on CD and DVD.

S&P

our pastor do?

Deceived Danny Nahliah Indoctrinates Deception & Hate

I felt compelled to write this after what Danny Nahliah said about the End Times and now; Lances article on groupsects. http://groupsects.wordpress.com/2009/07/02/you-know-a-lot-of-people-in-psychiatric-institutions-talk-a-lot-about-christ-end-times-spies/#comments

Nahliah says the following: “In Mathew Chapter 24 we read the signs of the end times and of the return of the Lord Jesus Christ!”

Great! What does he say the signs are..?

One sentence in this chapter sums it all up, “these are the beginnings of birth pains.” In Hebrew this means ‘contractions’.  I believe the world is in deep contractions never ever as before. The volume of disasters has rapidly increased. Some describe not as 2 fold, nor 3 fold, but a 100 fold!

Just take the explosion of the number of earthquakes around the world. According to a recent report on TV, from the first coming of Jesus to the year 1600, it was recorded that there was 1-2 earthquakes once in every 300 years. Then in the year 1600 there was 1. In 1800 it rose to 28, then to 128 in the year 1900, and then so many by the year 2000 that they have lost count. The Boxing Day Tsunami earthquake was the biggest ever recorded. The list of diseases, famines, natural disasters, wars and others have increased like never ever recorded in history.

Certainly the world is having contractions in very close succession just as a mother before she is about to deliver her baby. I believe Jesus is coming very, very soon. The BIG question is, “are you ready to meet Him face to face?” The Bible states that your very own will betray you and you will be persecuted because of your stand for Jesus and His return. By the way, this is before the rapture.

He couldn’t be more right yet so wrong!

Jesus’ disciples ask Jesus the question:

Matthew 24:3 “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

The first thing Jesus says about the End Times; the FIRST THING HE SAYS, is the following:

Matthew 24:4 “Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many.”

The church has FAILED to heed Christ’s FIRST warning about the end times. Deception is in, discernment is out. Many pastors, prophets and ministers have claimed that Jesus IS the Christ and have taught their own, doctrines, schemes, ploys, magic tricks, doctrines of demons and witchcraft practices.

Nahliah goes on to say: “The Bible says, during this time even His very elect will grow cold and fall away from the faith.”

BUT he fails to go and mention that straight after this verse the following key points as to why:

Matthew 24:10-11 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.

The passage suggests that because truth is absent and lies are promoted, wickedness will increase; therefore turning hearts cold.

Here are the some other verses about the end times deception:

Mark 13:6 Many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I Am He,’ and will deceive many.

Luke 21:8 Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I Am He,’ and, ‘The time is near.’ Do not follow them.

So Jesus further adds to not follow those who deceive even though they claim that ‘Jesus is the Christ‘ and declare ‘The Time is Near!’. Does that sound like someone I’m writing about?

So the time is near… for what?

I believe God during this time of persecution will separate the true church (bride of Christ) from the false church. I want to challenge you to pray in the Holy Spirit, read the Word of God, and prepare to face the challenging season ahead of us. Do not wait till it happens, because it might be too late and you might deny Jesus. The Bible says, during this time even His very elect will grow cold and fall away from the faith.

I can’t help but think that is what Nahliah is implying or saying. He is one of many that are saying this is the end, the end is near, the time is near for us to repent, the time is near to work really hard… Only tonight at a friends house did I read of a minister who claimed that ‘God’ took him out of his body and took him to the end of his life to see the end times and  see his new glorified body. (Truly promoting MSOG). He then read out supposedly William Branham’s journal who had a very similar experience! The risk ministers have in focusing on end-time teachings is:

1. their ego

2. gnosticism. The idea that they know more about specific details of the end, rapture,etc, then others and people naturally flock to hopefully grow in the same wisdom and newer revelations of the end times. However, the trend is set. To stay on top, scriptural context loses it’s relevancy; purposely confusing arguments take place, where in the end someone sounds as though they have a greater knowledge and seems to suggest they know what they are talking about; and the encouragement to yield because someone sounds as though they know what they are talking about, are all signs pointing to danger.

3. fear. The fear that often comes with the teachings of such end-times hoo-hah, encourages people to find more comfort by following those who ‘receive’ revelation in how to overcome in the end. Bare in mind that this is how cults operate: they prey on vulnerability.

4. Pride.

Not only that, through the entire article of Nahlia’s… is grace, understanding, hope, unity, the love of God, Christ’s salvation, the gospel etc, mentioned at all in his article? Or his hatred, division, pride and arrogance promoted more?

I think you’ll find the negative is more promoted. These are indeed the end times, and truly, the church is witnessing brothers follow deception and growing cold, promoting wickedness to the ungodly. The actions of the deceivers have had catastrophic results on the global, national and local church. Non-believers now see it as a time to do what they want because they see the church as worse then them; more religious, hate-filled, deluded, selfish, gossiping and condemners of people in today’s society.

I have been really upset for a lot of local ministries and close friends of mine who are continually getting further entangled and deceived by such gospels, schemes and false doctrines that I am praying allot to God about this. Please keep the body of Christ in your prayers and be wary of fear and pride at all costs in your Christian walk.  If they consume your heart and mind, who are you following?

S&P

Words of Wolves of the Word

http://www.ccc.org.au/som/default.asp?page=somInternat

From CCC’s School Of Ministry brag-page:

“Students have the opportunity to learn from some of the most gifted and experienced ministers in the world today – God’s general’s for this hour. In recent years this has included the following international ministries: 1. Dr David Yonggi Cho (Yoido Full Gospel Church – South Korea) 2. Reverend Bill Hybels (Willow Creek Community Church – USA) 3. Reverend Joyce Meyer (Joyce Meyer Ministries – USA) 4. Reverend Kong Hee (City Harvest Church – Singapore) 5. Reverend Nancy Alcorn (Mercy Ministries – USA) 6. Bishop Joseph Garlington (Covenant Church of Pittsburg – USA) 7. Pastor Dick Bernall (Jubilee Christian Center – USA) 8. Reverend Jesse Duplantis (Jesse Duplantis Ministries – USA) 9. Reverend Kathy Lechner (Covenant Ministries – USA) 10. Pastor Michael Pitts (Cornerstone Church – USA) 11. Dr Christian & Pastor Robin Harfouche (Christian Harfouche Ministries – USA) 12. Pastor Rick Shelton (Life Christian Church – USA) 13. Pastor Di Divett (Christian City Church – New Zealand) 14. Reverend Fergus McIntyre (Global Mission – Australia) 15. Reverend Margaret Court (Margaret Court Ministries – Australia) 16. Kate Miner (www.kateminer.com – USA) 17. Reverend Peter Youngren (World Impact Ministries – USA) 18. Lisa McInnes Smith (www.lisaspeaks.com – Australia) 19. Bishop TD Jakes (www.thepottershouse.org) INTERNATIONAL EVENTS Christian City Church hosts a number of exciting international conferences and events each year. Students are encouraged to serve and get involved at every level in order to gain insight into the management and functioning of ministry areas that may otherwise not be available to them. The advantages are obvious…”

Here is another example in how ignorant CCC are when it comes to teaching students with the aid of  ’successful leaders’. T D Jakes is a heretic: a Oneness Pentecostal (Jesus Only) teacher. It’s this teaching and belief that denies the trinity, carries the belief that Christ is a liar and denies the finished work of the cross: Arminianism. In OP doctrine, you and me aren’t saved and not part of the elect because we aren’t baptised in the name of Jesus Christ, but under the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I came across this because I heard about another dodgy preacher Michael Pitts that spoke at CCC. This man’s theology is so incredibly flawed with bad analogies and twisted scripture that he should be avoided at all costs! I will post up other information up on him in another article. I just want to look at the college side of wolvery. Is it the pastor of the church that endorses who can rightfully speak into students lives or is the final decision left with the principal of the bible college?

If theology is the  focus of the bible college, shouldn’t the decision be left with the principal to see the credibility of the teachers he allows to speak over students lives? BTW, who else from the list above is either a good teacher or dodgy?

Pastoring and Parenting Free of Guilt and Fear

There are lots of potential problems inherent in churches with the necessity for large organisational structures and large amounts of infrastructure. One potential problem is that people can become viewed more as resources than people, as Bull mentioned here recently on another thread.

If people are viewed as resources, one of the temptations then becomes to attempt to control them like resources. Various forms of control might include teaching that induces guilt or fear if they don’t do the ‘right’ thing, or exclusion from various ‘levels’ of involvement if certain required behaviours are not committed to. The latter is not necessarily immoral, but may be questionable at times due to its context in a ‘church’ setting, where theoretically people are all equals as part of the body of Christ, rather than members of a club with different strata.

The Purpose Driven approach from Rick Warren has aspects of the above, in my view, and John Bevere’s influential and popular teaching has other aspects of the above in my view. Many churches love both of these authors.

I’ve become used to thinking of megachurch environments as places where to some degree these things will happen, while also admitting that its possible in any organised setting regardless of size. My view is that over time, the degree to which they happen negatively affects the quality of relationships in the church, especially between leaders and those they lead. When fear and guilt are used as motivators, this can reduce the relationship between those in positions of authority and those not, to relationships with different degrees of power, rather than relationships of mutual love, respect and honour. It will also affect to some degree the way many members of the congregation view God – as a loving, generous, safe and forgiving Father (as in the parable of the Prodigal Son), or as an authoritarian Father whom they must please in order to be blessed.

But is my thinking really true? Could there be megachurches that encourage people throughout the body without seeking to control them through these methods? Will their ministries emulate this, both in their service to others, and towards those within their own ministry team? Once I would have thought that the latter happened almost as a matter of course; in more recent times, I came to the view that the former happens to some degree at least, as a matter of course. But its good to question your own beliefs, including this one.

So this long preamble is really leading up to a discovery that I’m so far delighted by – I’m reading a Christian book about parenting that really seems to understand the difference between controlling from the outside (typically using fear of some kind) and motivating from the inside; the heart. I’ve only read the first couple of chapters, but the understanding of the way God loves us; the way He is a Father to us and gives us freedom, which we then learn to responsibly manage, and that we can learn to emulate this in our parenting, is so encouraging.

The book, ‘Loving Our Kids On Purpose’, by Danny Silk, exposes as a lie the idea that we can control others, even our children, and sees the goal of obedience and compliance as an inferior one to the goal of love and relationship, where kids learn to make good choices and handle their freedom with responsiblity.

The thing that has struck me, is that the author of this book, Danny Silk, is the Family Life Pastor at a megachurch, Bethel Church in Redding, California (senior Pastor Bill Johnson). If they approach leading their church in a similar way to that described for building relationships in this book, then even if they have mistaken theology in some areas (and we all probably do), then I imagine that the church will stay fairly healthy. People will have the freedom to develop the way God leads them, rather than in some set way that is designated for them by an outside authority with a ‘resource’ driven approach. Leaders across the board in this kind of congregation, are likely to respect people’s freedom, and encourage rather than seek to control.

I hope this is the case. At the very least it is encouraging to see the other end of the spectrum of contemporary Christian views in this area. And the book, ‘Loving Our Kids On Purpose’, by Danny Silk is excellent so far. I am looking forward to incorporating the tools into my own parenting.

This link/post is not meant as an ad, but as a touchstone for thoughts on the issues – but some of you might be interested in checking the book out here.

*****************
RavingPente

Seeker Sensitive Bait and Switch

This is a question that occurred to me after reading Rick Warren’s email to Saddleback, where he said:

We also do not expect unbelievers to act like believers until they have the power of Christ inside them. Laws and politics cannot transform hearts, which is why we refuse to be political activists.

– Warren

I agree with his sentiments here. The question it raises for me, is when does the expectation for new Christian’s to ‘act like believers’ begin, and what does it look like? Sometimes God’s transforming work in people is visible immediately, but other times people may struggle with an issue for a long time, yet still believe.

What do churches define ‘acting like a believer’ to entail? Obviously something is expected of believers by Warren’s church, and many others. Is it a matter of demonstrating improving character traits over time, or is it a matter of conforming to the churches cultural expectations – such as tithing or attendance expectations? Some churches don’t seem to differentiate between the two.

Frequently churches do offer great acceptance to non-Christians who are struggling with issues. Once they become a Christian, does the attitude of acceptance change, and pressure begin? Can this be a kind of ‘bait and switch’ – offering unconditional love and acceptance but switching it for the conditional variety later? Is that how Jesus wanted us to do things?

Maybe that’s why we see some people reacting so angrily after being rejected by a church for sinful behaviour. If they experienced that wonderful acceptance and love to begin with, and responded in kind, then they experience rejection from people they grew to love, and will be upset or angry. It’s a bit like offering a kid a lolly, then snatching it from them and being outraged when they cry.

Those who emphasise repentance do at least let people know that there is a price to pay; perhaps that approach is more honest. But the seeker sensitive variety of church can still emphasise turning to Jesus, which in itself is a turning from darkness and sin towards light. Plus emphasising repentance does place pressure on people who may find themselves unable to live up to their repentance in some more obvious ways, and give up.

Knowing Jesus in my view entails walking with him through problems and issues, including these difficult ones, which aren’t necessarily resolved overnight. As we know more Light, we turn from more darkness, and mature over time. But on the way, we might not always look as though we are ‘acting like believers’.

Are we sometimes too impatient with God’s work in people when it doesn’t always take place overnight? Where should a line be drawn? Do some churches using a ‘bait and switch’ tactic, and is it OK?

Revival at Saddleback

Speaking of ‘Purpose Driven’ (in my last comment on the previous thread), apparently there is a revival taking place at Rick Warren’s church in Saddleback.  Warren feels that the recessionary times are causing more people to turn to God, and Saddleback is helping many of these people out with a large increase in food parcels etc.

I received this email from Facelift (please no comments regarding him since he can’t reply), and am putting it up here for any comments, since we’ve discussed Rick Warren and his Purpose Driven philosphy before, though not for a while.  Rick Warren notably has rejected the big salary and trappings that a man of his fame could have in Christian circles.

I am quite uncomfortable with the Purpose Driven approach, myself, however, its worth taking a look at what is going on at Saddleback right now.  It is extremely well organised, and does show what good organisation on a large scale can achieve.  It is a very influential movement which will and is affecting churches around the world.

************

RavingPente

Could the revival happening at Saddleback spread nationally?

“The Lord has done great things for us, and we are filled with joy.“
Psalm 126:3 (NIV)

Dear Saddleback Family,

In January, during my “Recession or Revival?” weekend series, I pointed out that history often demonstrates the fact that difficult times are fertile ground for spiritual awakenings.

Whether in biblical days or in the past 400 years, when people feel like giving up, some look up to God. I announced that we needed to prepare ourselves for the possibility that God would send revival in our midst during this recession. We now see it happening at Saddleback! In the past 60 days, our church family has experienced the greatest period of revival in our 30 year history.

Revival is an often misused and misunderstood word. Many so-called “revivals” are just emotional spectacles fueled by promotion with little biblical basis or result. So let me explain and illustrate some (not all) of the marks of true revival:

TRUE REVIVAL BRINGS SALVATION & TRANSFORMED LIVES!
In April, we averaged over 40 people EVERY DAYcoming to Christ for salvation! Like the first church in Jerusalem, “the Lord added DAILY those who were being saved.” Over 1,200 new adult believers were baptized in April alone! Saddleback members witness to their unsaved friends like no other congregation in America.

Recently I baptized over 800 adults on a single afternoon, spending nearly five hours in our baptism pool! I wish you could have heard the testimony of each transformed life.

TRUE REVIVAL BRINGS REPENTANCE & HOLY LIVING
The stories of confession, reconciliation, and commitment to the biblical disciplines of prayer, daily Bible reading, and humble acts of service have thrilled our hearts. Who will ever forget watching thousands of people nailing their lists of sins to a cross at our weekend service?

TRUE REVIVAL BRINGS SPECTACULAR GROWTH OF THE CHURCH!
Recently, over 2,600 people joined our church on aSINGLE DAY, committing to our membership covenant, and attending our four-hour Membership Class 101. We’ve offered Class 101 every month for 30 years and usually about 100 to 200 people attend and commit to our membership requirements. Imagine a membership class with 2,600 joining on one day!
50,334 people worshiped at one of our 46 Easter services. 45% of these people (not including the children in AllStars) were under 39 years of age. Pundits erroneously speculated why I cancelled two TV interviews with George Stephanopoulos and Mike Huckabee on Easter weekend, but I was simply overwhelmed with our 46 services and needed to conserve energy!

TRUE REVIVAL LEADS TO MINISTRY IN THE COMMUNITY
During these days of revival, 20,000 grocery bags were given out and you returned over 40 TONS OF GROCERIES to feed the poor, the widows, and orphans around us. During this recession, you’ve once again been a beacon of hope to our community. I wish you could read the thank-you letters from people who have never previously attended a church.

Over 30,000 of you are now ministering to your neighbors through our 4,000 plus small groups across 146 cities of Southern California. Our weekend series on “The Jesus Model” and our small group curriculum series, Wide Angle: A Christian Worldview, that Chuck Colson and I taped for you are reaping more changed lives in our communities.

TRUE REVIVAL LEADS TO GREATER MISSION AROUND THE GLOBE
No church in history has ever sent more members on mission around the world. On our recent 5th anniversary of the PEACE Plan we celebrated the 8,292 Saddleback members who’ve served overseas in the past five years. Saddleback mission teams have now served in 134 nations!

Then last weekend, 2,908 more families signed PEACE Commitment cards to GO and GIVE in the next 18 months. This will enable us to complete our 10 by 10 goals, including being the first local church in Christian history to literally obey Christ’s command to “go to EVERY NATION” by the end of next year!

Why does God continue to bless Saddleback in unprecedented ways, and what would it take for this local revival to spread nationally?
Many factors contribute to God’s continued blessing of Saddleback. Some are unexplainable, like God’s sovereign grace, and others are the result of choices God’s Spirit has led us to make. Obedience brings blessing. I could list a dozen factors but I’ll only mention a couple:

WE REFUSE TO BE DISTRACTED FROM JESUS’ PURPOSES FOR HIS CHURCH
For 30 years, we have kept a laser focus on the five biblical purposes of worship, fellowship, discipleship, ministry, and evangelism. We refuse to be distracted by secondary issues, legalistic bickering, misinformed accusations, or envious critics. “Avoid foolish arguments, stupid controversies, spiritual quarreling, quibbles, and conflicts. These are pointless and worthless” (Titus 3:9). “Anyone who lets himself be distracted from the work I plan for him is not fit for the Kingdom of God” (Luke 9:62). While others debate the church, we just DO it!

We have a BIBLICAL plan & PROCESS TO CARE FOR AND DEVELOP DISCIPLES TO full MATURITY, AND TO MOBILIZE THEM FOR MINISTRY & MISSION.
When God wants to bring a bumper crop of new baby believers into the world, he looks for the warmest incubator he can find. Most churches are unprepared to care for large numbers of new believers. Saddleback has a proven discipleship process that has brought tens of thousands to maturity. Most churches believe in discipleship but their only plan is to preach it. Since people forget 90-95% of what they hear within 72 hours, it takes far more than listening to exposition to develop a mature disciple. A national study by Lifeway revealed that churches using the Jesus Model discipleship process we learned from Jesus (from “come and see” to “come and die”) are healthier, produce far more mature members, lead in generosity, and send more out on mission than just teaching churches.

WE DEEPLY LOVE LOST PEOPLE THE WAY JESUS DOES.
We are not afraid to associate with unbelievers or people we disagree with. You cannot win your enemies to Christ; you can only win your friends. So we purposefully build bridges of love to people so Jesus can walk across that bridge and save them. We don’t view unbelievers as “the enemy” in a “culture war” rather we see them as the mission field and as people Jesus shed his blood for. We do not compromise our biblical convictions, but we do apologize if we act or saying anything in unloving ways.

We also do not expect unbelievers to act like believers until they have the power of Christ inside them. Laws and politics cannot transform hearts, which is why we refuse to be political activists. Jesus said “I did not come to condemn the world, but to save it.” We want to have a Christlike ministry, which means we will be called “the friend of sinners” and will be attacked by modern day Pharisees and those who view everything in political terms. But the results are worth it: Over 22,000 new believers have been baptized in the past 10 years and we will spend eternity rejoicing with them!

Today I read again these words from my friend and mentor, John Stott: “The mistake the Pharisees made was worse than being a mistake about the meaning of holiness. It was actually a mistake about the very nature of God. They thought he avoided sinners, whereas God doesn’t avoid sinners at all. God loves sinners. He comes after them! He went after them to the desolate agony of the Cross. He has come after them in the Holy Spirit, and he is pursuing them himself today!”

WE TAKE RISKS IN FAITH
While others splash around safely in the shallows of their comfortable church culture, you Saddleback members have always been willing to launch out into the deep where the big fish are. Our 30-year history has been one of attempting in faith what others fear to do. But where God guides, he provides. This year, we launched a risky new distribution channel to provide Bible study curriculum to church small groups nationwide. This “curriculum by subscription” (the 21st century version of the Sunday school quarterly) is The Purpose Driven Connection magazine. In a year when every other magazine is cutting back staff, we launched one – in a never-done-before format. The result? Churches worldwide are receiving solid small group materials and our second issue WON A PULITZER PRIZE for an article!

Friends, genuine revival is our only hope. Nothing else can heal our hearts, our families, our land, our world. That’s why we’re making an enormous effort to serve other churches this fall through aNational Life’s Healing Choices Campaign beginning in September. The eight principles of the Beatitudes of Jesus are the true path to recovery – whether personal or national recovery. Pray that other churches will join us in humbly following the path our Master has laid out in the Beatitudes. And pray that our efforts to serve other churches and small groups with this quarterly curriculum will result in transformed lives for the global glory of God!

It is a privilege to be your pastor. I love you with all my heart.

Rick Warren
Saddleback Church
Purpose Driven Network
P.E.A.C.E. Coalition

Gifts – or Convenient Labels?

Ephesians 4:8-12 (NOT!)

⁸…AND HE GAVE CONVENIENT LABELS TO MEN…[big snip]… ¹²for the categorising of the saints for the work of service, to the smooth running of the religious organisations of men.”

- Heretic’s Private Translation (RP’s Toned Down Version*)

Has anyone ever filled out one of those ‘gift questionaires’, which churches sometimes use to help people identify their giftings?  They are a little like a less sophisticated version of personality testing.  I haven’t seen one for many years, but I remember filling them in maybe 20 years ago.

No one would dispute that we are all gifted in different ways, and that scripturally all these gifts are valuable and have their place in the body of Christ.  Sometimes though, ‘gifts’ can pigeonhole people, who then may end up stuck in a role until they are totally sick of it.  (Different from the concept of burn out.)  Sometimes perhaps they don’t get the chance to explore an area they really are more gifted in.

Some may be gifted musically.  This is great – until the worship team becomes small, and they are called on almost every week, with no break or subjected to an overly onerous schedule.  Others may be gifted at looking after children – the same thing can happen.  They may find themselves almost never making it to an actual church service.

A friend of mine is very talented with hospitality.  After a while, people would say to them, why don’t you organise this social event, or why don’t we do this at your place, as you have the gift of hospitality.  I think my friend does have this gift – but as a result, they weren’t often on the receiving end of others’ hospitality.

Of course we can all participate in other ways as you don’t need a particular gift to serve in some areas – doing my turn in the creche for example, despite having no special ability there (and a distinct absence of ability at some times).

Everyone has joked at times about the gift of stacking chairs or cleaning toilets!

Anyway, this is not a complaint – more a question of how widespread is this pigeonholing, and has anyone seen it dealt with effectively?  Its hard for some people to get the chance to try out some other area – it may already be full of people gifted in it, or they may be so busy with what they always do that its just not convenient to move people around – or people don’t want to move around.

As for me, I did many things over my time in churches, but the only gift I was regularly told I had, was the gift of encouragement.  So I was lucky, I guess, since my ‘gift’ was unable to be scheduled, and not burdensome!     Though I used to wonder – is that just what they tell you when you don’t have any other specific talent? In my early days, I was a little disappointed to have such an unspectacular gift!

*The original version may or may not have included the term, ‘Whore of Babylon’.

*********************

RavingPente

Teaching Superstition; Giving on Stage

Teaching Superstition

I watched a TV show by Derren Brown the other night, which looked at how people develop superstition.  In a nutshell, people identify actions with effects that have nothing to do with each other, but associate a causal link between the the two without any real examination.

An example might be walking under a ladder, then later blaming that for a subsequent fortunate accident.  Derren Brown repeated a social experiment where a buzzer operated every time a goldfish swam past a black line on a fish tank.  The people in an adjacent room thought their actions were causing the buzzer to operate, and associated random behaviours with the buzzer, which were then repeated to try to earn more buzzes.  One hundred buzzes in half an hour would earn a prize, so they were motivated.

At Pentecostal churches I’ve attended, I’ve seen various people lauded on the platform for giving large sums of money to building funds or various church causes, with an associated testimony of how God blessed them in response to this.  An example would be the one we covered on this blog last year where Phil Pringle invited up a couple who gave to the miracle offering at the Presence Conference and subsequently fell pregnant.  The successful pregnancy and birth was attributed to them giving to the miracle offering.  This was used as an incentive to inspire (or manipulate) more people to give to that year’s offering.

But where is the causal link between these people’s giving to these purposes and God answering their prayers?  Maybe in His grace He would have answered their prayers anyway; maybe He answered their prayers despite what they did.

What about Acts 8:9-23? Simon the magician is rebuked for thinking he can buy God’s gifts with money.  In his case, the gift he wanted was the ability to perform miracles; to infuse people with the Holy Spirit.   Peter responded to him, saying “^20…“May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money!”

It’s ironic that this response of Peter’s is the opposite of the financial salvation some people hope for when they give to these offerings.

Giving is good when done freely, but we are not to try to ‘buy’ gifts from God.  Yet people who teach this, teach superstition – that if you give to this particular offering, you have the _chance_ of having your prayer answered – and conversely, if you don’t, you could miss out.  It pretty much lines those people up with soothsayers and magicians, whom the Bible tells us we should have nothing to do with.

Putting these people up on stage and claiming their answered prayer is because they gave to an offering is a way of reinforcing this message and is pretty much what Derren Brown demonstrated.

Giving On Stage

Putting individuals up on stage at all to describe the magnitude of their giving is pretty woeful in any case.  I have seen it though, numerous times during building campaigns.  Once again, the aim is to encourage people to give substantial sums of a greatly sacrificial nature.  (As much or more than a deposit for a home, in most cases on stage.)

Generally the people would testify of how much they pledged, and the subsequent miracle events that had happened that allowed them to meet this pledge, that was well beyond their means.  Somehow, despite the miracles, I was never quite comfortable with this way of announcing it.  Perhaps it was my conservative Anglican background, but this scripture seemed relevant:

Matt 6:2-4

²“So when you give to the poor, do not sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, so that they ^(B)may be honored by men ^(C)Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full.

³“But when you give to the poor, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,

⁴so that your giving will be in secret; and ^(D)your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you.

**********************

RavingPente